Good morning, Professor, good morning to all of you. I am very happy that we can once again host you and have you here with us, together with our viewers and listeners. Good morning, sir. Good morning, Mr. Jarosław. Hello everyone. I welcome Mr. Jarosław's esteemed wife , who, as usual, is responsible for the entire technical aspect here, and it is important to remind her every time, because it is easy to shine on camera, in front of the camera, in front of the lens, or on air, whatever you call it. But it's all these people behind the scenes who do this work so that others can shine for a while. Therefore, we should always appreciate and thank them all the more. Yes Sir . Yes Sir. except that where in our video we talked about our beautiful halves, where many people, kings and non-kings, many warriors would not have reached the place where they were. It's as if this isn't support for the fair sex on our part, and many people forget about it, it slips away somewhere. Therefore, great respect for our wives, for our mothers, for our loved ones who support us in what we do, in our daily struggle. Professor, we are meeting today on a very, I think niche topic, because the professor is talking about some kind of association and so on. Well, in today's digital world, there is no point in associating somewhere, gathering in some circle of rural housewives, or I don't know, carpenters, locksmiths in a crafts guild, because today's digital world allows us to access information without any problem, without any, so to speak, third, fourth or fifth parties. Please tell me, do you share my opinion here? Well, I think that as a civilization we are created to live in communities, so each of these forms, which I think you have perversely pointed out here as an unjustified form of the need to report, justifies it on every level, because such a circle of rural housewives now plays a special role. People simply get to know each other and remember what they look like even in the countryside. I remember the times when everyone in the villages went to the so-called cottages. This is what they say: go to the cottages. It consisted of everyone visiting each other literally almost every day. It was rare for a day to happen when someone didn't come to see someone else. Now it is so in villages, even in small ones, that we organize picnics once a week so that we know who lives in the village. So all forms of association are absolutely appropriate. The point is that we can say that there are some that have a, I would say, cultural and moral character, while others have a formal and legal character. And I think that here today we will talk more about the latter. Very well, Professor. I do n't know how it is where you are, but I would like to mention that in my home village there are benches, this is a district of Mysłowice. At one time we belonged to Lędziny Tychy until 1970, probably 1960, as far as I remember, although I wouldn't insist too much on that . And on our street there was such a place and a hazelnut at Mr. Kula's, at Kula's grandfather's, at Mr. Kula's. This is where both young and old would always come and discuss. We, as children, from the age of 10 to 12, would go there and listen to these older people who were able to share decades of experience and life experience in these cottages, talk about mining, forestry, everything that happened there, that was created somewhere, life experiences, the craft you had in your hands, you acquired your first skills in these cottages by listening to these older people. experienced, reliable specialists, or a butcher of some massage, it's as if one thing was connected with the other and that was the whole power, the whole power of this topic and this is where it translates into the association of these civil law ones. Please tell me what forms and possibilities we have for civil law association? Mhm. Well, we have several forms, but the ones I practice in particular are associations. I organize associations, but we can also create a foundation, for example. However, when it comes to those that do have, they are strictly formalized. I organize associations, generally we have two types of associations. registered or ordinary. Generally speaking, I have specialized in organizing, creating and operating within registered associations, i.e. those with a higher status, because they have enormous power. We do not realize that we can do this thanks to such registered associations, and a registered association differs from a regular one in that a registered association requires a larger number of members. currently only seven and it is registered in the court in the National Court Register. However, this ordinary one only requires three members. It is no longer registered in court but with the starosta, but it also has much fewer powers. For example, this ordinary three-person group cannot run a business, cannot de facto participate in the legislative process. And what we will be talking about is that we establish associations in order to implement grassroots democracy directly through such an association. It, such an ordinary association, also has such a dysfunction that if we wanted to submit an application through the association for, for example, recognition of the unconstitutionality of some legal act to the Constitutional Tribunal, it does not have such powers, because it cannot have a nationwide dimension expressed in the fact that it has its own, one could say, delegations, its branches in individual regions. Professor, are you saying that seven country housewives, seven, I don't know, locksmiths, turners, er, or other people from the industry can form an association and directly influence the legislative process, i.e. the process of creating, discriminating against or changing some bad, pathological laws and so on. So you mean to say that seven people in the country need only to raise their legal status and they can already participate in the life of the Sejm, Senate, parliament, and president? Mhm. Yes, that's exactly what the Associations Act says . This is exactly how we do it. And for years these associations in which I either participate and joined , or invented and co-founded. There are a few that are very active. Exactly. in this formula where we started with seven. We used to start with 15, because the regulations used to require that there had to be 15, so for example, the Best Way association started with 15 members, but the current association, the last one we founded, the National Shield, already required seven. And this is the formula we are participating in. There are only a few of us focused on a given industry and it is through this association that we represent or express communication directly with the government, with ministries, with top offices and institutions. We submit, we submit our bills, we participate in subcommittees, so that's exactly what it is. Seven village women can get together if they have a common idea and goal. can establish an association. In practice, it takes a few days to effectively establish such an association and acquire the authority to establish grassroots democracy, because it is very serious, so to speak, and there the association, well, why, what does it give me, it is a classic manifestation of grassroots democracy. The media, yes, the media, and politicians are very careful about this, so that people do not know that by establishing an association they can almost walk in off the street, of course at the invitation of the chairman of the subcommittee, to a subcommittee meeting and submit their own proposal for a given project that is in the legislative process. they can submit their own draft amendment to these draft regulations together with a justification and it must be voted on and is always voted on. And to make things even more interesting, it is usually voted positively. And in a moment I can explain why it is usually positive. Professor, you're stirring up a nest here. Many people will actually hate you, but not for reasons, not from parliamentary circles or bureaucratic circles, but ordinary people will hate you to the bone, because this issue of our everyday life, that it's impossible, it's not possible, that it won't work , you've just completely crushed it here . Seven people can change the world, time and space. And here, everywhere today, I had such a conversation with a close or distant friend who says he has lived for 47 years, he has not been involved in anything, he does not work and he is doing well and so on. So of course I referred it to your petition, to your activity, so to speak . So what you're trying to say here is that because all these y, let's call them y, whiners, using the language of the Smurfs, that it can't be done and it can't be done and it can't be done and it won't be done, then it's all in ruins here. I see. Yes. Well, the Best Way association is an association that I founded 15 years ago. As of today, he has almost 400 interventions, 300 of them are probably something like 90. When we last spoke it was 383, but we have already completed several more in the meantime . Therefore, there are almost 400 of them. One association has 400. And we are the ones who mainly have interventions at the level of governments, ministries, state institutions, at the highest level. Usually we rarely get down to the middle level. Yeah. Well, a lot. Well, this is such, this is such, this is confirmation. We are the confirmation. My other associations, I mean mine in the sense that I was their initiator, because the association, which is extremely important, does not belong to anyone. They belong to society, they do not belong to the president, nor to the board members, nor even to the members themselves as such. I belong to society both formally and factually. And so they are mine in the sense that I put my heart into them, that's why I say it, that's why I say mine, so that it sounds good, so that someone doesn't think that I'm somehow usurping any rights to these associations. So he's another association like this, uh, which I'm a co-founder of, the originator of the idea, the ecological building also brought together a dozen or so entrepreneurs, uh, saved several dozen, at least several dozen thousand jobs. And we have liquidated the activities, perhaps of an agent nature, but certainly of a lobbying nature, of two French and German concerns in Poland. By changing the regulations we saved the entire industry. This is the ventilation systems industry, so these are great successes. And now I'm working on creating a National Shield, so when I have time, I'll expand on what it does. So yes, there doesn't have to be many of us. What is important is that we have formal representation and we have an idea, a concept, ambition, self-discipline, a big heart and we simply act effectively. And so, so it works in another way, that is, it simply takes seven, seven people who will work hard for the benefit of others, but this is not possible in the Polish nation, so to speak, because it is not about seven people working hard and the rest skimming the cream off it, like the proverbial cow and the goldfish. I don't know if the professor heard. I haven't heard it, but it must be good. I'm telling you now. Well, there were two houses. One is beautiful, well-kept, clean, fragrant and there is a big barn and a nice cow. I already know how this must end. A lovely, lovely, lovely, so to speak, animal. Next to it there is a mud hut somewhere falling apart, the owner is dirty, neglected and so on. And so you look at your neighbor and say: "I'm going fishing." And he caught a goldfish. And so she looks at her, she looks at her so little, you say: "Eat it, don't eat it." And she says, "Listen, I'll fulfill your one wish." And she says: "You, but the golden rabka fulfills three." Well, somewhere in fairy tales I fulfill one of my dreams, right? And he thinks so quickly , thinks, says: "You know what? I have a neighbor who has a beautiful house, a beautiful, big cow. He gets up at 4:00 in the morning, grazes her, takes care of her, looks after her, and so on and so forth." And the fish asks him: "And do you want the same cow?" And he says, "I don't want him to die." Yes, yes, I expected the ending to be like this. But you know, you know, it's like this, I gave you such a multi-faceted answer. The first one is that it 's a very nice feeling in general and it's very nice to be able to represent not only your own interests but also those of other people. This is very cool. Yes, just like that. This gives a lot of satisfaction. This gives a lot of pleasure. It gives me a sense of, I would say, fulfillment. I like it very much . And it fascinates me when I see that subsequent projects that people would usually say had no chance to be realized socially, are simply realized through one dimension, through the dimension of courage. So if someone sees business in associations , then they shouldn't do it a priori , because it requires additional funds. I think that my wife and I contributed about 150,000 PLN very sparingly. It's so very economical. Yes. Yes. Or maybe even, or maybe even twice that value. Well, those 400 interventions didn't just take care of themselves . When I say 400, these were the ones that lasted a year and consisted of about ten letters, so I count it as one. uh, so many or 20 or so media appearances and so on and so forth, I still count it as one intervention, so you have to invest a lot of time, but invest is a good word , because it's basically investing some kind of good. People see it, um, people respect it and are happy about it, and when you see someone happy, that's a reward in itself. Well, now I have prepared a few more petitions. Among other things, I wrote a letter to the Prime Minister and the President asking them to immediately suspend the draft law on additional powers for the state labor inspectorate, because these regulations did not help employees at all, but on the contrary, they drastically attacked entrepreneurs. Few people understood this, because I am a labor law lawyer and I specialize in this field, and I have almost daily contact with the state labor inspectorate. Therefore, I knew that these regulations were terrible, they are terrible, they are already unconstitutional and so on. They are simply bad. So I just wrote it in the evening, I remember I was very tired, but I thought, I'll sit down and write. I read it and wrote it down somewhere around midnight, I think. I sent it to one of the messengers, and it got 46,000 views almost immediately. It spread throughout Poland because I place these petitions in a special system, and they are immediately addressed by this system to those to whom I mark them, i.e. the Prime Minister, I mark the President, the Prime Minister and the relevant ministry, in this case, there was work there. And a few days later the Prime Minister withdrew from this regulation. And I can give you a lot of such examples . So what was needed? Well, there are 30 or so million people there. Anyone in Poland could do it. What's missing? No awareness. And secondly, a little courage. Thirdly, some, some determination. People are very afraid of stigmatization, that if they write something, someone will write something bad about them and they will feel bad. Somehow you have to impregnate yourself with it and just do your thing. And the fact that so many people felt that I had never seen, and they will never know that I did it, because that's the coolest thing, that we pass these people on the street and they don't take advantage of these solutions or these various benefits , from these 15 years of our work in associations, they don't know it was me. And that's very cool. That's what it is, there's something very positive about it, that they're happy, it gives them pleasure, they pass someone on the street without even knowing that it's thanks to them, and that's probably what I like most about all of this . Some kind of anonymity. I recommend everyone to try it, and then everyone will feel pleasure from it and you will be willing to join. So the professor touches on an interesting topic again, that is, taking, doing. So, in the first point we have to take the biggest step, which is the step of faith. We must believe in what we want to do and behind this, behind faith, no matter what we call it, no matter what we use this faith for, the second point is that there must always be actions, that is, we physically do something. And this is the most beautiful thing, because whenever we experience something in our everyday life, the most banal things, getting up, I don't know, looking out the window, seeing the sunrise, the sun, the sunset, it is always somewhere the result of faith. We must believe and act. We won't find a wife, we won't find a husband, we won't earn a penny if we don't believe in it and get up, we don't follow through , we don't act as if we were doing trivial things every day with faith , but only when we believe in it and act, then that faith grows. This faith is gaining speed, but it is always directly related to action, to activity. Faith is never static. She never stands, she never waits. She is always on the move. And it's like Lester Samral in his cool teachings, faith to change the world. He described it fantastically, I think, in the sixth or seventh meeting, that a man of faith runs after faith , he follows it, and it is far ahead of him. And the more we accelerate in this faith, and now it doesn't matter whether we make pens, or roll, or whether we design cars or computers, we always run after what we believe in. We need to accelerate more. So this is the greatest thing. But this is both external faith and internal faith. You have to have this inner faith, it is easiest to build it on outer faith. But at the same time it is so that, because I would still call this faith a little differently or frame it a little differently. I would say that at least I'm talking about myself, I work with, I create a certain idea and then I work for this idea, that is, something that I truly believe in. For example, I believe in the right to human dignity or I believe in the right to human freedom. to freedom of choice and yyy and on and on this I build my strength yyy and on this I build my strength, because yyy an example is now a petition that I wrote and also to yyy within the association is also on this petition system I invite you to sign for a reduction in the size of fines. And I knew that if I wrote this, there would be a lot of people happy, but there would also be a whole lot of people who would just attack me, they would start , right, insinuating that maybe I was a road butcher and I wanted to promote this type of attitude, right. I start from a different assumption, that we are free people. That is, we cannot be treated as people who only serve to shoot at them. Uh, because last year yyy 2025 the amount of yyy fines increased by almost 50% and amounted to 1 billion 350 million. Yep, that's a ridiculous amount. Well so I believe that we are free people and we cannot create situations and regulations that will treat us as slaves, because we cannot introduce an additional tax, but this money is de facto collected illegally in the constitutional sense from us through certain mandates. They can be raised indefinitely. And you had to find that faith in yourself. I haven't won yet, but I will win of course. I will continue these petitions and repeat these videos and letters for so long that it will take me, I don't know, a year or a year and a half, but we will reduce these fines. And here we are talking about a certain principle that we cannot do this uncritically, without asking us as a society, because if a referendum were to be held on whether to increase these mandates by 50%, of course, in a referendum this idea would be lost. No one would want to increase fines to some outrageous amounts, but no one asks us. And that's my point, right? Therefore, here I am trying to find such ideas within these associations. This is the idea. I believe in a certain idea and I follow this idea and I think to myself that whether I feel bad for a moment and feel better or worse, whether some people attack me or not, it's as if in a sense it doesn't belong to me. It doesn't belong to me. I mean, I have a certain task to do and it's a bit higher than me. Significantly drastically higher than me. In a sense, there is a certain idea, I defend this idea, but as a consequence of the fact that I defend this idea, someone will attack me, but it does not affect me, because, because I am not defending my idea, I am defending the ideas of other people, and this makes me immune to this attack and it is easier to bear in connection with the above, and I also encourage you to perhaps look at it this way. If anyone has a better one, please feel free to share. I'd love to meet you here. You know what, when you say that, I immediately remember a conversation between two gentlemen, Professor Dudek and Dr. Artur Bartoszewicz, where one of these delinquents had typical communist beliefs, such as raising the age of obtaining the right to leave, increasing fines, penalties, and encircling this ordinary man. And here Dr. Artur Bartoszewicz says: "No, why bother doing that? Just build drift tracks, just educate, just free up millions of hectares that are lying around and nothing is happening there. Make paintballs, make tracks, make motocross races, so that these young people, as they say, just like we did in our youth on a mosquito, if you hit your butt, you'll know how to drive on the road, especially on gravel. And a lot of young people today don't know that. And by moving towards education, by moving towards familiarizing themselves with this road, with this or that car, bicycle, moped, electric car, this or that, it will allow us to avoid all these undesirable things on the street, and unfortunately, we won't eliminate the lunatics and idiots. They simply grow on their own, you don't plant them. But I think we need to approach this task intelligently on a multi-faceted basis, namely, for example, introduce, I think we talked about it here on the channel once, introduce certain rules for time penalties. I mean If I've exceeded the speed limit by X, then maybe I should wait 15 minutes. Because if that's the case, I'll consider whether, if I'm in a hurry and want to get somewhere, it's worth waiting 15 or 20 minutes. And if I exceed it even more, then maybe I should wait 30 minutes. The second issue is that you said it perfectly well, that in the United States, in some states, the police serve a very educational role. And not so. Does that mean these people must have a certain spirituality, as you rightly pointed out , but they must also have awareness and intelligence? It's not like we send young guys out on the roads who can only tell you "ticket, ticket, ticket." So many thousands, so many thousands, because intellectually, he can't afford more, perhaps sometimes both, and it completely destroys the narrative, the perception, the needs, and the good image of the police for this type of attitude on the roads. Let these people take on some educational role, instructive, even some discussion, but I'm not saying that these are the only instruments. Maybe Well, even if you listen to the program, you'll find 10 other better ideas. It certainly will, but the point is that we need to increase our intellectual effort and find a solution other than just this stupid, stupid way of punishing people for thousands of dollars , because today they're collecting 1,000,000,000,000,000 from us . In a year, they'll be collecting 3 billion, in 10 years it'll be 30 billion. Ladies and gentlemen, there's a speed camera on the Zakopane road that's a record holder. I even know which one it is. In my opinion, it's in some pointless place, completely pointless, but people are actually making fun of it because they leave such a distinctive spot where you don't even know it's there and they end up getting caught. Everyone has a few speed violations there. In my opinion, there's no danger there at all. That's my personal opinion. I have the right to have one. What 's the point of robbing people like that, of installing such a machine to rob people? How can anyone be outraged by what they see? I say, but if anyone here is a driver, let anyone here cast the first stone who hasn't exceeded the speed limit or hasn't crossed a solid line. Let someone listening to this cast the first stone, let there be one such person. Well, ladies and gentlemen , now I'll tell you where, what, what the consequences of this will be. Radars will be installed. First, there will be twice as many, then 10 times as many, then 200 times as many, later drones will join in, and you will be slaves. And there's no way you wo n't break traffic regulations for various reasons, and you will simply become financial and mental slaves in every respect. This is teaching people to subordinate themselves to the nature of a slave. And I disagree with that. I fundamentally disagree with that. I'm not talking about extremes, but the truth that there are those that do occur, but they don't even constitute a fraction of all road accidents. And now, because there are extremes that don't even constitute a fraction, a fraction, a fraction, a fraction, we all have to be slaves. We've been forced into a slave mentality. No, I fundamentally agree with that, because it's inconsistent with human rights. Professor, I absolutely disagree with you here. All those things you said about control, 1,000 speed cameras, a million speed cameras, a billion and a half, 30 billion. I have a fantastic solution for this. It's been around for some time. Electric cars that will think for you, speak for you, won't exceed the speed limit, will park themselves, will surveil you, because for a certain company, or even a certain country, these electric cars can't enter military units, various other things. So this is a solution, a total surrender of our freedom, sovereignty, I don't even know what to do, because it's no longer an electric car, it's already a collection, a compilation of espionage. It's such a conglomeration of rubbish, for which, so to speak, even Polish doesn't have words to precisely describe it. So we're going to the slaughter, many people are going to the slaughter, accompanied by beautiful music, in beautiful clothes, in other words, giving up their freedom. fundamental, our spiritual, moral, physical, social, economic freedom, and the list goes on . We'll limit our possibilities. We'll introduce electric cars, they'll do everything for us. We'll just be an intellectual pudding that we'll be pouring from one side to the other. Mr. Jarosław, I would n't hold that against people, those who want to function that way. If someone wants to be, as you so beautifully put it, an intellectual pudding, or if they want to, they're comfortable with this formula of not exposing their right to freedom. Okay, well, that's their choice. Um, but I don't like the idea that we're all supposed to be the same. We only just broke away in '89 from a system where it was said that, yes, it's equal, that everyone has the same thing, that it's only a bicycle, but everyone has it. Well, we've only just broken away from such a system, and here we are, on the other hand, being forced into an exactly identical system. So for those who The formula is: for conformists, please, politely, because they will feel happy, good, and safe in this, paradoxically, or maybe not paradoxically. Okay. And for those who are nonconformists and need freedom, a framework must also be created for this. So if someone wants an electric car, please. If someone wants a horse-drawn carriage, please too. And if someone wants a horse-drawn carriage, please also politely. If someone wants a regular one, please also politely. And that's how it is, of course, here we're not talking about cars, but about a certain model of life in general, so that we can function in it. And that's why we need these associations. Well, look how much good we've done with these associations, because it was in the agricultural industry itself that we implemented an agreement on harvest assistance. Well, I'll repeat it again, because I've already said it at least twice during our broadcasts, but it's something incredibly important. An incredibly important example. There are at least dozens, maybe even more. 100,000 Polish farms benefiting from this agreement, which would have gone bankrupt because the costs of other forms of employment were very high. We proposed the most liberal agreement in Europe. It's not even in Poland, I don't know if it's in Europe, but it's certainly the most liberal in the European Union. Regardless of the net salary, the gross salary is only 300 złoty, meaning contributions and taxes. And so, for those who couldn't afford to legally employ workers , to employ them legally, funds from the broadly defined state treasury flowed into the state treasury , true, because that's where the social component and the tax component are. But we, each of us citizens, also benefited from this , of course, because apples and soft fruits are much cheaper. Herbs are much cheaper because the harvesting costs are very high. Therefore, they are much cheaper because of this, so we all benefited. This and this is solely thanks to this right to association. Another association had a huge influence there, because I implemented this project under the association of blueberry producers. American. And the association itself is relatively small. Well, these associations are generally rather small, because it's not about being large, but about having many of them. A lot, right? And they should be, so to speak, intellectually and legislatively fertile, because we live in such a legal soup. Everything surrounds us, everything, everything we look at has its legal dimension, every element. And now it's incredibly important that these associations aren't just passive observers, but that they immediately come up with legislative initiatives. Now I'm a little late for our recording. We had an appointment a few minutes earlier, but I got a call from a very nice lady , a lady, and a gentleman from Katowice, who asked how they could introduce a particular legal regulation that politicians of all stripes have been refusing to introduce for five years , because they'd already mentioned all possible options. Believe me, it's a fantastic concept. Justified in every respect. In every respect, from the spiritual, above all, this is probably the greatest dimension, through some kind of rational dimension, through the social dimension—I don't want to say because it's their idea, and maybe I wouldn't want to burn it down here, so to speak. In any case, they've been trying to implement it for five years, and it's a wonderful idea, and no one is interested. They ask me how it is, what should we do? I say, you don't have formal representation, you have to start by establishing an association, and then I'll tell you what needs to be done, and then you go. Once you have this formal representation, an association, you'll prepare a draft law. If you can't do it , I'll help you, and then you'll prepare a regulatory impact assessment, and there will be a justification there. If you ca n't do it, I'll help you, and then you'll prepare a SWOT analysis, because it has to be prepared there for various reasons. If you can do it, I'll help you. And then you'll go, and depending on who's in power, what the political situation is, and so on, you'll go either to the Prime Minister , a specific minister, or a political club. At least 15 MPs, as we know, or the president, and you'll come with a ready-made package. Any politician will take it. Why will politicians take it? Because politicians know that if society supports a certain project, then it's a project needed by society. This means it will be a political gain, and they will probably vote for them later. Therefore, the ministry doesn't have to work hard, and politicians don't have to work hard, so they're very happy to take advantage of such projects. What's more , later on, you'll be in the subcommittee watching to make sure no one else takes it down, because you have the right as a member of an association. And then you simply have the result. They say, "That's fantastic." I say, "Well, yes, we've been doing this for over a decade, practically two decades." And in social relations, you see, there is no magic in it. There is no magic to it. There are simply so many elements, quantifiers that need to be met, accepted, started , acted upon, and then a year later we have a result, most often positive, in the form of a specific, concrete law or an amendment to some other law that we want, because if we wait for politicians to do it to us, they will never do it . And why would they do that? And who would do this? Imagine that you are, I don't know, the chairman of any political party. Yeah, I don't know, you woke up and suddenly you stayed today. What an acclamation, someone elected you. Well, yes, I want it , and just yesterday you had a lot of ideas on what to do. So who will you do it with? So who will you entrust this work to? He will say, you will go to the members of the political party, he will say no, Heniek, Ziutek, Frania, Ziuta or whatever, whatever their name is, take it and do it. And why would they do that? What are they like there? are members of the party, they are not working people. And besides, they have legal competences, they don't, and legislative competences , they have, they don't, and so on, and so on, and so on. Let's not count on anyone at all, certainly not on any political parties. This association is a brilliant, brilliant formula of grassroots democracy. If you don't really know how to do it, I'll tell you how . I will teach until we have 1,000 affiliates. Until we establish 1,000 associations. There should be few small ones, but very many. Exactly. Yes, Professor, you have touched upon two very interesting topics again, which is not much, but a lot. I always say that the biblical people are old spiritual people, so we are talking here typically about faith. There were no large congregations. These were small congregations of a few, several dozen people who met, who worked, who prayed, whose word was so spiritually grounded that it changed time and space. But you also mentioned a very interesting thing here. Once a politician takes it, he doesn't have to work hard, and he gets some ordinary work, the ordinary person can shine with something and so on. Ladies and gentlemen, it is terribly, terribly depressing that we simply have people who do not want to work, who want to take money, who do not pay fines, precisely these terrible ones, because they are protected by immunity. There are still several social groups that do not pay these fines. Here we mean the police, prosecutors, judges and everyone else pays. This special caste, let's call it, doesn't pay these fines. Therefore, there is absolutely no logical justification for them to want to do anything for us. Like one, two, three, five. No one will do it for us. No one will establish an association for us and no one will submit an application for us because they do not live our lives. Because they don't live our lives. Ladies and gentlemen, I encourage you to sign another such petition. It is also now available on the petition system. It can also be found on the website drogaprawna.pl. Legal driving how to drive legal how to drive drogaprawna.pl. This is a portal that I also founded a dozen or so years ago to be independent, to be sovereign from all these virtual Polish onets, all these others, so that we could have our own publisher. It worked great . A great idea and it is, I would say, a redoubt of freedom and my own sovereignty. I publish what I want, not what someone allows me to, and when I want, not when someone allows me to. And there is also one of the last entries there, it is a petition asking for exactly what Mr. Jarosław mentioned, namely to introduce legal regulations under which both officials and judges will be subject to financial penalties for unlawful judgments and administrative decisions that are in accordance with the law, but also criminal liability. That is, what exactly, of what type, I mean administrative decisions and rulings contra legem, i.e. those that are directly opposed to the content of the norms. As a lawyer, do I have to tell you that I am experiencing a total heart attack combined with some kind of brain hemorrhage with this entire legal system, and especially the justice system. That is, if people knew the scale of court decisions that are against the law, they would not believe it. They wouldn't believe the scale of administrative decisions issued by officials that are counter-legitimate . And I would like to emphasize that contralegem is a state that is categorically prohibited by both the jurisprudence of the Supreme Court and the Constitutional Tribunal, as well as 100% of legal doctrine. But this is this is totally common. Now why is this so? Because it is exactly as Mr. Jarosław said. No one is responsible for this because they do not live our lives. If they started living up to our wishes and paying our fines, they would start looking differently at illegal speed measurements, for example, or at speed cameras. But because they don't live our lives, and here is one MP whom I know, I like him very much, he's very nice and we're on first-name terms, I've known him for a long time, but I've recently started talking to him, but not maliciously, but to the point . I started calling him the aviator because in 2025 he logged the most hours flying to Warsaw. Well, I know which one I know. Yes. Well, no, let's not talk about it, because he'll get offended, but he'll still take us to court . But anyway, there is one, you can check it out. This is my friend, a very nice man, and now this is the problem, because for example, it is really not a distance from here to Warsaw. Well, to be honest, it would be faster to get there by train. Oh, and even faster by car. Well, apparently he must, must, has the nature of an aviator and must fly. They don't live our lives. as if they started living our lives, so that these regulations would be completely different. So I encourage you to sign this petition. Of course, the officials won't like it and there are negative comments on LinkedIn, including on my profile. I guarantee that most of the people who write these negative comments are officials and perhaps these judges. But these are our employees. We society, we plebs, we ordinary people. Since we are down here, we are the ones who employ them. We pay tax, we would have to work for every penny so that they could receive a salary. And I want and we demand nothing other than the law of convenience. We only demand this, we demand it. We demand the right to convenience. We demand that if the regulations state that A, then neither the official nor the judge can decide that it is B. Well, because we can all read at an elementary level and therefore we demand responsibility, as you said, for a special caste, but of course you didn't come up with that, because it was a famous judge who said that they are a special caste there. In this connection, please do not hold any grudges against you, me or Mr. Jarosław . This is what this judge clearly defined, but that's how it is, because they live different lives and we want them to live exactly the same life as us, to answer exactly the same way. I want to, because I don't know if you want me to, I'm talking about myself and that's why there's a petition there, I encourage you to sign it, that it's not us, the society, that no longer accepts, we totally don't accept that our office is above us , that the people we pay to represent us well, are wagging us like the tail to the dog. So there are more and more of these groups of aware people on the Internet and it's already a slippery slope. Whether it lasts another year, or 5 years, or seven, or 10, it will end in one and only way, namely, that we take over grassroots democracy. I truly believe in this and I am a huge advocate and I have been working on this for years and I encourage you to do the same. Let's assume these 1,000 small, 1,000 small associations. Everyone should do something, three interventions a year, and then you can watch. Now let's multiply. That 's already 3,000. Yes, they're gone. There are not 3,000 elements that we could improve every year. Very well, Professor. Well, it was rough today. Honestly, it's really nice to hear this. So what I said at the beginning, faith, faith and actions. And here, when a person gets into a rush, even very unpleasant things cannot bring us down. They are unpleasant, they exist, they are difficult, but, but they are not able to shake our knowledge, our faith, our way and form of life, of being, of who we are. Who we are is not what we look like, but what we represent. This is the essence of our being and life. So definitely, definitely moral grounding, spiritual grounding is what, if we build a solid foundation, we will build on it whatever we want, even if we build the entire pyramid. And I'm talking about the Japanese pyramid from 1982, which is 3 km 4 km high, because there is such a project, Mr. Kamiński and Mr. Kurek exhibited it in 1980, probably six years before their death, about a year or two earlier, where the Japanese clearly stated that they had a 4-kilometer building designed, but at present there is no technology that would guarantee success. from this project. So it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter if there are no such possibilities today. The important thing is that we have this vision, we have this faith and we follow this path. Professor, I would introduce one more perspective in literally four sentences, just to conclude. You know, ladies and gentlemen, if I could encourage you to be active in this way, because I know that everyone has their own job, their own worries, their own family. Everyone has some shortcomings, so everyone has some kind of burden . This is a natural thing and we explain it to ourselves that we would do something, but we are so tired, so tired. Yes. And that's the truth. And that's simply the truth. Only that and sometimes we just say to ourselves: "I would do it, but maybe they will take revenge on me, or maybe they will attack me, or maybe something." This is also true and this is also true and it is very important to know that it may be that some people will cut each other off and not attack, but let's change the perspective. Let's imagine for a moment that I have such doubts, I close my eyes for a moment and think to myself , let's imagine that I am 100 years ago or maybe 70 years ago. It's either World War II or it's just after World War II. First we have one totalitarianism, then we have a second totalitarianism. How much courage was needed to fight for change in both of them. And every action carried the threat of death, even for the family, and sometimes for the neighbors, and sometimes for the village. And now this is, this was courage, what we, what we live in and what we have this tendency to feel sorry for ourselves and, right, this demonization and this, you know, this creation of some kind of artificial threats. They were brave people. we only need 1, maybe even sometimes one hundredth of that courage. So what are we even thinking about? We take and do. We will meet here in a year and there will already be 500 associations, and in two years we will meet and there will already be 1,000 associations. So I encourage everyone to pass this on to everyone else. I will teach you how to set them up, I will teach you how to make them work. I will create clusters of them and we will create direct democracy. We will manage it our own way. We will not wait forever for the proper authorities to come. It will never come, because power is a demon coming out of the abyss and in and and and we will simply create our piece of the floor the way we want, and not the way others want. I encourage you to do this. Exactly. you posted an interesting, interesting piece here about it being a demon that comes out and that's exactly how it is described in the Bible clearly and distinctly. From what I remember, it is before Saul, when they demanded to give us a king. And the Lord God said clearly and distinctly: "The king is a fraud, he takes money, rules in his own way and so on." and and he gave them this king with all these, let's call it, amenities. Later, when we read about Saul, about David, what was going on, how it happened. So we, as free people, have to create our own spiritual and moral space, and not wait for someone to do it to us, because they will do it, as you said, in a demonic, twisted, twisted, avionic or any other way. Our home, our street, our neighborhood are what we have influence over and they should look the way we want them to. It is precisely about this demon coming out of the cave that the yyy excellent Russian yyy Russian philosopher writes, although he has lived his whole life, almost his whole life, in Paris. A man not very spiritual. He writes his books brilliantly and I recommend them to everyone. I think it was called exactly where this phrase, where he put this phrase, that power is a demon coming out of the abyss. I think it was called the Kingdom of the Spirit and the Kingdom of Caesar. Fantastic spiritual layer in all his books. Fantastic, I recommend it. And he writes there about the case of Domitian, I think, Cesar. The emperor Domitian, who was the second son of his father, so he had no chance of ruling the state, so he was educated to be a poet, supposedly a very good one, and a painter, supposedly a very good one too, but his son, his older brother, died due to hanging and suddenly became emperor. how did he become this emperor from a spiritual man, nomenomen, look, such a gentleman with such something, he became a hyper murderer and that's why the saying was coined that power is a monster coming out of the abyss, that as soon as you get power, it suddenly wipes you out. I mean, I don't know if it erases or replaces what wasn't there, because I think it's more like it replaces what's missing in a person, what wasn't there, because it seems to me that it's like you said, because we talk privately many times and you often bring up this spiritual layer, that if a person has a lot of it, it's safe, if it's not there, well, there 's an emptiness there and there's something to replace it with. And it is precisely this demon of power that can brilliantly replace it in oneself, as we see in many people. I often say that politicians should be people who don't want to be politicians. I mean, they don't need it, but I have absolutely no idea how to catch them. But there should be such people, because it means that they do n't need this power. They don't need that power and they clearly have other elements there and that demon probably wouldn't reveal itself, that demon of power within them. Well, I have absolutely no idea how to select such people, and even more so how to convince them. So, um, so that this demon does n't swallow us up with someone else's power, someone else's demon of power, let's create grassroots democracy. Let's take as much power from the government as possible. This way we will have more freedom. Okay, Professor, I know you have a meeting soon. Unfortunately, it is with a heavy heart that we must end. I would also like to thank you very much for today's fantastic meeting. It's truly unique, with each meeting the power grows, so I can't wait for the next meeting. At our next meeting, there will probably be three of us, if the professor just sets the day and we'll be there, it'll be totally crazy, because it'll be such a compilation that it'll make my head hurt. Professor, thank you very much . Thank you very much. Until next time. I can't wait for our next meeting. Have a nice, peaceful day. See you soon. See you soon, Professor. See you. Thank you very much and all the best to you.