Hello everyone and welcome to Legend. Exceptional broadcast today as it is the first time that Bernard Arnaud, the head of LVMH, the world's largest luxury group , will give a long interview about his career, about his life. How did the dinner go with Jacques Chirac, with the Didis, with the princess ? What interested President Shirac most was Diana's beauty, and so he had almost more of them for her. than for the paintings of Sesane. So, in 1984, you bought the Bousac group which was bankrupt at that time. This is a group that isn't necessarily doing very well. We had 12,000 people, we had committed to looking at 10,000. The group we built from there today has 200,000 people. Each time, we see Bernard Arnaud in a private jet, for example. You've been criticized for that a lot too. You even want to follow my trail? So now I've fixed the problem. A few years ago, I sold my property; I no longer have a private residence. No, when I do that, I rent a plane. Hello everyone and welcome to Legend. Today's broadcast is exceptional because it's the first time Bernard Arnaud will give a long interview about his career, about his life. the head of LVMH, the world's largest luxury group with more than 75 houses including Louis Vuitton, Moeti, and Tiffany & Co. There are brands like Dior, and very beautiful brands like Oropiana as well. We're going to ask him all the questions. He allowed me to ask him all the questions, not only about his career, to really understand the pillars of his life and the pivots as well, which really allowed him to grow and very quickly, you will see the family company, how he took it over, how he made it explode then the Boussac affair, how he then took control of LVMH which is today the largest luxury group in the world. Just before we start the show with Bernard Arnaud, you can subscribe to our YouTube channel in 30 seconds, friends, it really only takes 2 seconds. Between 150,000 and 200,000 of you subscribe to Légende every month. So thank you very much for that. Feel free to comment on the show and then like it. Then, as an audio podcast, you can listen to us and follow the shows on Spotify, 10er, Apple Podcasts and Amazon Podcasts. In any case, whatever happens, three times a week, thank you very much for making Légende the number one podcast in France and now we're off for an exceptional show with Bernard Arnaud on our legs. Hello Bernard Arnaud, on your legs. Welcome Mr. Arnaud. I'll take back the clap. Thank you for accepting the invitation. I am very happy to welcome you. It's a pleasure. I know that you do very few interviews with people, and we have guests who tell their story to understand the inner flame, to understand all their life stages. Why did you agree? Thank you again, but it's so rare. Well, because you convinced me firstly because I watched a number of your podcasts which I find excellent. Thank you so much. And I think this is an interesting opportunity to talk about the LVMH group and what I've done in a direct way. You told me I could ask you absolutely any questions to redo the route. What is your definition of luxury ? So, this might surprise you, but luxury is not a word I particularly like . Ah good? because it is often associated in a somewhat pejorative way with aspects that have nothing to do with our business. Frivolity, superficiality, uh, uselessness, uh, bling bling and so on. Whereas our trades, the trades of the group, are artisanal trades that make, manufacture, create very high quality products that have nothing to do with that frivolous side that luxury brings when we use it. However, the entire journalistic industry, the entire financial analysts, have classified us in the luxury industry. Moreover, both words are imperfect because first of all , we don't think of ourselves as an industry, but rather as a group of artisans and creators who produce limited quantities of absolutely exceptional and top- quality products. So nothing to do with frivolity, er, superficiality, and so on. So, I still live with this definition of the luxury industry, but uh I don't completely agree with it at the level of uh phraseology. You are very, uh, very product. You are a lover of the product. Yes, but it is necessary when you manage trades which are artisanal trades with many creative personalities, with craftsmen who are often almost creators themselves, I am thinking of our watchmakers that you know. These are really jobs where you need to be close to the product. Long-term success is about the product and, in addition, in the luxury industry, it would be necessary to bring together French heritage, the vision of France in the world. You see, all of this is a collection of very refined, high-quality things that are not well evoked with the overall definition. Okay, that's all. Now it was widespread everywhere so we could n't change it. What product best represents luxury for you? It's very difficult. She is that question. But that's very difficult because there are a huge number of products that represent our activities. I should have brought, for example, the watch that was made by Louis Vuitton and that workshop, La Fabrique du Temps, in Geneva, which you know, where they made a watch with an extraordinary mechanism with an automaton inside and on the dial we have the portrait of Instein. And when you turn the mechanism a little, Einstein sticks out his tongue. Look, this is an exceptional product. So. There's the eye that moves. Isn't there something in the eye? Yes, yes, yes. The eye also moves. Gives a little wink. Finally, it's you know that photo where he's sticking his tongue out. So. So we come to the photo where he's sticking his tongue out. It's extraordinary. There were only two models in fact. Oh dear. We made a report, would you be interested in going to see it with Jean, your son who now manages the watches in the lodge. Louis Viton. If you go and see them, and the watchmakers are exceptional too, we send them our love. That's a pinnacle of precision in craftsmanship. I think that the factory of time is probably the most exceptional watchmaking workshop in the world today. Is there anything free that you consider a luxury? Yes. Yes. Free. Luxury, I would say as far as I'm concerned, and which is also quite closely linked to our professions and which is free, is time. So, it's free in a way, but we're still short of it . And as far as I'm concerned in particular, well, but time is a fundamental parameter because when you produce very high quality projects, you have to do them with time. You have to be patient. Sometimes we redo them and uh when you are very busy uh running uh brands like that uh with incessant travel all over the world, well time is a uh thing that is hard to find and is often lacking. There you go, even if it's free. You work all the time, you manage to take holidays, to rest? Yes, of course. Yes. Yes. Take vacations regularly. No. It is essential to change your mindset, to think about something else for a period of time. But I'm working, but I think I already mentioned it to you when we saw each other before the show. At the same time, I'm having fun, you see. So it allows you to work a lot without suffering. Yes. Do you enjoy what you do? Is entrepreneurship a passion? Yes, it's a passion. Yes, I learned while preparing the show that you also handle the artistic side? Are you involved in the business? You are extremely good, you have a real knack for it . Do you also handle the artistic aspects of the houses? I am indeed very involved with the products. I have always really enjoyed design, and the link between the success of a product and its design, ever since the beginning of my activities. So, in luxury brands, what is obviously at the center of the design is the work of the creators, the craftsmen, but it is also necessary to ensure that the products that have been designed are a success worldwide. See? and so necessarily the leaders of the different brands and myself very regularly, I deal with it, I deal with it with them, we have discussions and I have a certain aptitude, I believe, to see what will work. So. And so I do it regularly and often we manage to design products. Can I give you some examples? Yes. What kind of product, for example? those concerned. For example, when we invited Princess de Gale in 1995, she inaugurated the Sesan exhibition at the Grand Palais. There, he said at the time Mrs. Chirac called me saying "But do you, uh have any gift ideas for Lady d'Ana who we are going to receive and who is coming to have tea with you at the Elysée?" Good. That was 2 or 3 days ago. And at the same time, we at Dior were launching a new product with its director Sné Toledano, who is its creator. So we thought, but deep down, uh, could this product, which was a quilted leather bag with Dior's iconic cannage pattern, interest her? And my Dur chairman at the time, Sydney, very quickly got on with bringing all of that together. I went with him, we spent half a day working on it and we got a result that you surely know now, which is called the Lady Dior bag, and which Mrs. Chirac gave to the princess, and she liked it very much and bought several models. She traveled all over the world with this bag, which became an icon of the hard house. So. How did the dinner go with Jacques Chirac, with Didi, with the princess? How did it go? It wasn't a dinner. Jacques Shirac did not come to dinner. Jacques Chirac inaugurated the exhibition with her and me in the morning and during the exhibition the painting of Sesane was magnificent. I could clearly see that what interested President Chirak the most was Dayana's beauty. And so he had almost more of a god for her than for the paintings of Sesane. So. And so, and then we went to have tea in Lée. Just before the show resumes, I am very happy to announce the release of the book on the history of legend by Hor cadre publishers. For the first time, I tell not only my story, but above all the behind-the-scenes of the legendary adventure, the trips that went wrong, the doubts, the criticisms, the attacks, but also the extraordinary encounters we were able to experience and the most memorable moments we have ever been able to tell here on air. All the information to order the book is in the description of the video and the audio podcast. You were born in Roubé, I'll go over your life story again if you don't mind. We're going to start by understanding it step by step, as you wish. Uh, on March 5, 1949 in Roubé, your father was an engineer and managed Ferré Savinel, a construction company. Uh, your mom was the daughter of the creator of Ferray Savinel, so you can understand how it worked. Um, your parents met at work back then. Hm hm. What value did they teach you? How were you educated? On what value? Well, we had very strong family values, you know . First, he reigned supreme in the family. a love between children, parents, grandparents. Wow, fantastic, huh? Uh, they were, uh, as you indicated, uh, managers of the company near which my parents lived. And uh they had a sense of effort, a sense of work that they had uh instilled in their children, in their grandchildren, uh so partly in me and uh they were very demanding. Their main values ​​were loyalty, trust, and a sense of duty. My grandmother was very Catholic and we were in a really family atmosphere and an extraordinary warmth with a lot of love, a lot of mutual love, you know. I, for example, adored my grandparents . So, you bought back your grandmother's house? No, I never sold anything, you know. But I redid it, you know. I rebuilt it because this house, which was part of the family business site, had been squatted in, I had left, there was no one there anymore, and the business had moved. So when I saw that, I decided to renovate it to how it was back then. Along with the furniture from that era, I've restored a good portion of the furniture. Yes. Yes, because when my grandmother passed away, the furniture was distributed among the family and well, I asked some family members, my cousins, some of my uncles and aunts, if I could get the furniture back, I tried to refurnish it as it was at the time. Well, I have to say that I lived in this house for 20 years. In addition, the offices were still there. So, I also renovated the offices and these offices, I made both a center for the training of EDC engineers and a center for Live which is the institute for the return to activity that I set up or rather that I financed which is run by Mrs. Macron. Do you sometimes go back to that house? Yes, I try to go back at least once a year. Absolutely. Yes. And it's always very moving. Moreover, I also showed it to the current First Lady and it was quite, quite touching. It brings back a lot of memories for me. That's where I prepared for the Polytechnique entrance exam. That's where I spent my childhood, well, I'm not going to tell you all about it, but no, no, but we'll come back to it in 2 minutes on Polytechnique if you'd like . I heard something, that you had put a school report card in your grandfather's coffin. Yes. H I don't know if that was true or not. My grandfather and his relatives adored me, you know. My grandfather was the first person to take me to visit construction sites because my grandfather was an extraordinary person. He set up this company after having been a soldier during both wars, and having had a career, a military medal, well, a very, very exceptional career during his battles. He started this company and he ran it. I remember, you see, when I lived with them, with him first and then when he disappeared in 1959 I lived with my grandmother for 20 years. I could tell you why if you're interested, but I don't know if it will interest your audience. Well, we'll see. No, we're here to understand the journey. We can go wherever we want. We're following you. All right. So this moment, right, is at the time of his death. He died on June 26, 1959 and uh he always paid close attention to my academic progress. He was very happy to see that I was working well and uh so I had received my grades which were good and I put them in his coffin. And my grandfather, I learned a lot from him when I went with him to construction sites, to see the site managers, to see the workers. It was, it was still very, very interesting for me. From the age of 5 or 6, he took me in his car with his driver because at the time, even though he didn't have significant means, he didn't have his driver's license. always a driver. He was always in the front with the driver. And I will always remember when I slept in that house, you see, to tell you where we come from, I would hear the horses passing in the morning that were taking the materials to the construction site, you know, because there were trucks, but there were still horses, big draft horses. It was your mother who gave you a taste for work, your grandfather, it's a mix of all of that to understand where it comes from. You say it was a family value. They were my grandfather and my father, they were entrepreneurs. He helped my grandfather, who started from scratch, to grow and develop. My father, who was a power plant engineer, took over the company afterwards and they were really very involved in all the details, with, as in all small businesses, ups and downs, you know. When my grandfather died in '59, we always went on holiday at the time to the North Sea, not very far away, and my father didn't go, you know , because since my grandfather had died, the banks were starting to say, "Be careful, be careful, will we be able to continue financing the work, the loans, and so on, you see?" So uh well, afterwards, it never happened to me but still uh it's quite something, it remains so uh and and they gave me the taste to work in the company. Can I ask you a more personal question? Well, when you have a great fortune, how do you instill a love of work in your children? Because you have children who are brilliant, we'll come back to you later, but you're moving forward 50 years. So, you got it yourself, how did you pass it on to your children? Well, uh, on a different scale, uh, it was the same atmosphere, because very quickly I showed my children what a company was, I talked to them about how I ran the company. They followed all the investment and creation and establishment paths around the world that I have undertaken. They were immediately interested and I also told them, if you want to participate in all this in one way or another, uh you really need to get a good education because otherwise uh uh it's not possible. Especially since we have connections in that world where we see children, when their parents have a certain fortune , spending it, buying big cars, spending their evenings at parties and other things. So there you have it, that's how I succeeded, I think she motivated them and in addition they were all in different ways quite gifted in what they undertook in terms of studies. Well, I was going to ask you whether they were good at school or not, or what happens if the grades weren't good? Well, I was trying to take care of it and I have a son for example when he was taking his baccalaureate exam for which I would come home in the evening at 6pm to help him with math problems. Yes. Yes. Because he wasn't good enough at math to help her climb. No, he was very good at literature, since he entered the general competition in mathematics, which is a bit more difficult. So we don't say his first name then. No no no no but he is very good but there you go and he needed this shock to really get to work, he got his baccalaureate easily, but I, I was doing math problems. There was another one I had a little more trouble keeping up with because he was very good at math. Oh, it was the opposite. It was you who had trouble following. Yes, I was very good at math too. Finally, I was good at math, that's all. But uh, for him, uh, first of all, it was many years after me. So the math had evolved and uh I accompanied him sometimes uh in the and once he asked me to go and listen to an oral exam in a competition uh Normal Sup. I already knew he was a great friend of Silbalix and he told me he was coming to listen to my oral exam at Normal Sup. So I went and uh I listened, I sat at the back of the room because I was already a little known so as not to be spotted. And so I saw a statement written by the teacher on the board. Okay, and then my son, I won't give you his name either, there's no point, remained dry for 30 minutes. I still remember the topic. It was about differential equations, not if that means anything to you, but anyway it's quite complex and so uh I thought that's it, he's done for, it's never going to work. And after half an hour he filled in the table and uh I think he got 18 yes he got in well he was received among the first to follow. Then I had to convince him that it was better if you wanted to go into business to go to Polytechnique. And you went to Polytechnique and passed the entrance exam in 1969. Yes, at the time, you were going to graduate in 1971. We know the prestige of the school. What do they do at Polytechnique? What exactly do you learn there ? Well, at Polytechnique, in my opinion, the most important thing, or at least what I felt was the most important thing, is that you first learn intellectual rigor. Moreover, even during the preparation period, when preparing for scientific exams, it's still uh very rigorous. And then, we learn to solve difficult problems and simplify them. So. And that's what has helped me the most because in business life, we are often faced with difficult problems and I believe I have succeeded in simplifying and inspiring the people who work with me when they see a complex problem, instead of spending a lot of time torturing themselves trying to examine the difficulties and simplifying them. And often it works well, and besides, at Polytechnique I had an absolutely brilliant mathematics professor. Yes, those are still memories. whose name is Laurent Schwarz who was the first Frenchman to have the Fil Medal in mathematics and who the Fil Medal which is the equivalent for mathematics of the Nobel Prize. In 1950, he had that and he gave absolutely masterful lectures that were crystal clear. Yet in some areas, he is very well known for the Yes. Yes. the theory of distributions. Well, it's something very complicated, but he simplified it all. And when you listened to his lecture in the amphitheater at the time, which was on Montagne Saint-Jeun Viève, you immediately understood that he was someone exceptional. There are teachers who know how to make something complicated accessible. We had a common characteristic, which is that we were born not in the same year but on the same day with your teacher from the time of Laurence CFT on March 5th. Yes. That's not why I have a math stump. Well, is that what you need to be when you're an entrepreneur? Do you need to be good at math, after all? You need to know how to count, you know. You need to know how to count. Yes, it's not about solving the most complex equations nor about being able to do math problems, but you do need to know how to count. You know that you are a more difficult interview than others because there is very little information about you. Oh yes? Well why give out information? That's true. It's mainly because it's quite old. Do you still have any entrepreneurial friends from your Polytechnique days ? Have you made friends who are still friends today? Yes, I still have friends from Polytechnique. Absolutely. Yes, yes, there are some who have succeeded very well, in fact, notably the top student who was president of the general geophysics company, huh. But if you want me to, I'll continue. In that, there are many who have taken a step back from operational activity. That's how they retired, in a way. Finally, they are advisors. Yes, yes, they are more like the operational president of a big business. You left after you graduated from, so your dad also graduated from Centrale Paris. That 's Central. He was the head of the company. So Fer Savunel, we were talking about it earlier, is a company in the construction industry . Upon leaving school, you were 22 years old in 1971. You joined the family business. Why are you going back there instead of going somewhere else in Paris? Is there a reason? I think you wanted to take up the torch because I always wanted to run a business and be able to help my father in his business and I was considered as such by my friends at Polytechnique. You really don't understand anything, do you? When you graduate from Polytechnique, you have to go and work for the State in the ministry, you have to be chief of staff or something . Anyway, I wasn't interested. Has that ever crossed your mind? No, no, and no, I have always been interested in running a business. That's yes. Even before entering engineering school, this has always interested me, and I was already giving ideas to my father and grandfather. I still remember it even when I was 10 years old. That's funny. Yes, yes, yes. What kind of advice do you give a 10-year-old father who owns a company? I was giving him advice, which annoyed him by the way, I was saying to him, "But look at that construction site there, it's being done by a competitor. How is that possible? How did they manage to get ahead of you? You should look at the calls for tenders. Is that possible?" Yes, that's it, I said that. Yes yes. I had the motivation and then I would go to the workshops, I would go to see the chief mechanic with whom I had become friendly in order to work on the equipment that was used on the construction sites and so on. I was also going, well, there was a place at the start, then there were trucks, at the start there were horses, then there were trucks and I was very amused and very interested with big trucks. These were trucks that were called Berliers at the time. I don't know if they still make those trucks, but I really liked them, I liked them right away . I couldn't see myself doing anything else . That's where you learned the product culture of going to uh check the details because I know you're very detail-oriented, you have to be. Yes, that was later, when I entered the profession after Polytechnique. Because when we talked about it together , you both said the product, the product is the most important thing. Marketing and all that is fine, but above all, it's the quality of the product. You know, I once gave a talk at Louis Vuitton with the manager at the time who was a bit embarrassed afterwards because they asked me , there was everyone from the marketing department, the young people and so on, and I said especially in a company like yours like Vuitton, you shouldn't do marketing. Don't do marketing, you have to create and it's your products that have to make their mark, right? and conduct market research to determine which product to make for which country, which customer segment, and so on. That's for the mass market, that's for the products you see in supermarkets. Okay, if we start selling these products in a supermarket, but uh, for high-quality products, uh, , artisanal products that are aesthetically quite original, it's the customer who has to uh follow, that we have to try to almost train them to use the product, huh. You're not going to find the new Dior with a market study, that's not true. This is the product, the product, the product you need, there you go, you always visit all the LVMH factories, do you go to the stores? Yes, I do the tour regularly. Yes, I just went around the world to visit, I went around, yes. Heading east . H, did you go to Asia? I have Oui oui , I have I went to Oui oui in Hong Kong Beijing in Seoul in Tokyo and I ended up in Los Angeles for the hard parade. And what do you look at when you see the shop windows? That's really the detail. We can't imagine what you do when you arrive in front of a shop. Let's not exaggerate, but I I don't want to sound pretentious, but I can see what might need improvement. Look, and I often say to some store managers, especially in Paris, you're going to hire me as visual merchandising director. H because I go and then we modify things together and I come back the following week. He told me, "Sir, it's true, it's working much better since we made these changes, and that pleases me." Is this something you've had from the beginning? Well, I've always had it, even when I initially worked with my father in construction, you know . You might be wondering why you made the company change direction? who comes in three questions. But come on , you've changed, you've made a change. Actually, I'm just going to remind you of the dates because it's impressive. In 74, you joined as construction manager, finally, you became construction manager, general manager in 77 at 27 years old. You took over the company entirely in '78, so you were just 29 years old. How do you manage to progress so quickly ? But that wasn't something that was planned, it happened on the ground, you know. And in '76 uh I said to my father after a few years, listen, uh we have two activities. We have a construction activity, uh, for which we build for clients, uh, real estate development companies that build buildings, uh, factories for, at the time, they were still large textile units. I think we had done the offices of the Boussac factory, one of the Boussac factories. We built a factory for Prouveau for the Roubet line and so on. But I told him, listen, the unfortunately essential factor for the customer's choice is price. That's not interesting because we're forced to cut corners on quality in order to reach the price being asked, or perhaps a competitor who made a mistake in their calculations ends up saving money, and that's not good. On the other hand, it is much more interesting for a profession like ours to sell directly to the public to clients whom we can convince through the quality, the beauty of the product, the beauty of the plans and the beauty of the place where we build. And so that's why in '76, I convinced my father to separate from the construction side of things to focus on selling to the public. So. And so it was called Ferinel. And it was called Ferinel. We contracted. It was called Ferinel. So. After that you're going to the United States. So there were lots of articles about it back then too . You're leaving in '80. You told me I could ask you any questions. I'm going to go through it step by step. That was back when François Mitterrand was elected President of the Republic in 1981. There were articles saying that you were fleeing the socialists. It was because of politics that you left. No, not at all. I never left for politics. Moreover, afterwards, I forged a completely excellent relationship with President Mitterrand. No, I left because the economy is in trouble and you look at all the economic specialists of the time will confirm that the economy is in trouble, right? We had taken measures that were entirely in line with the program which allowed the military president to be elected, but which led France to evaluation after evaluation because there was no euro. enormous inflation, uh, difficulty with the unions who always wanted more. Finally, we were in a climate that did not encourage investment. So I told my father, listen, before investing in new projects, given the situation, I'm going to see if we can't set up something interesting in the United States. That's it. It was for economic reasons because I thought, and I wasn't the only one, but ultimately the majority of people thought so, that France was economically headed for disaster, and when things improved with the arrival of Ran Fabius, I came back. You enjoyed living in the United States, even if it wasn't very long, it was still... Well yes, it wasn't bad. That's it, that's interesting. In any case, at the level of work, it's a much more pragmatic approach where there is much less, uh, let's say, criticism of companies that are working very well, that are developing, and a more dynamic market, right? So yes, it wasn't unpleasant at all. I definitely prefer living in France, that said, but it was a good experience. An excellent experience. Yes. Have you been to Miami or New York? You... I used to live in New York. Yes, I used to live in New York. My office was in the Rockefeller Center. You met Donald Trump back then , he was a real estate developer if you say so. Yes, yes, absolutely. Besides, I think there's a film where I can be seen when I go back, I don't remember which one, I was shown a film. Yes, yes, yes. So, I know you had a pretty incredible anecdote about him. I heard that you had a dinner anecdote when you saw him again. Yes. Yes. Little by little, I became friends with him and so when he was president during his first term, I saw him regularly and then also and now I see him too and I was visiting shops on the west coast on the east coast in Miami with one of my sons and we were invited to dinner in the evening by President Trump. Not long ago, you're talking about not long ago. Yes, not long ago. So, uh, we're driving around and then we hear the radio. This was after the first assassination attempt against him, with the bullet hitting his ear. With the bullet that went through his ear. So, you were supposed to have dinner with him that evening? No, no, no, no, no, no. It was after and we hear so we were going to have dinner with him and I hear on the radio that he was threatened again because he was playing golf it was a Sunday and that there were people the secret service found people in a bush with a rifle with a scope I don't know what. So, in the end, they had to protect the president and so on. Okay, so I told Alexandre, it's over, the dinner is n't going to happen. So we arrive at his house there, a Miami which is magnificent and no no, dinner is still planned. So, very good. He looks as warm as ever. We sat down with him and said, " It's terrible what happened this afternoon," and he replied, "Everything's fine." So. Wow! 2 to 0 or that he survived an assassination attempt evening 2 day the day the day he had this attempt targeted that day he was still in a good mood and finally Ah yes totally yes totally relaxed totally relaxed. We left there around 11pm. Yes, yes, what is Donald Trump like? Can you discuss this with him when there are customs duties? I know, I'm discussing it. Yes yes, I don't always get what I ask for but I discuss it. Yes, yes, it costs nothing to ask. During his first term, I had nevertheless obtained an exemption for French wines and spirits . Ah yes, we can change Donald Trump's mind. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. But you have to consider first that he is the most powerful man in the world and secondly that he is a very intelligent person, right? So, when we start saying the opposite, the discussion turns ugly. And if he knows that no one he sees is saying that about him , it's normal. Me too. If people say unpleasant things that come back to me , I don't really feel like being nice to them. Well, that's what it seems, at least in theory . No, it's also that simple. It's as simple as that. So, it's not up to me to judge what the President of the United States does, you know. Have you ever thought about how useful you are to the country, how you support , I believe, 200,000 people, you have 200,000 employees today. Have you ever thought about going into politics since you know how to manage a company so well? Is this the same as managing a state? What is your opinion on this? B, I think those are two different things, huh, that I wouldn't have the necessary qualities to do it because it requires a lot of self-sacrifice and it requires a vocation that I don't have. You need a calling, right? Uh, I don't have one. And yet it's still, uh, a job that is not generally very long- term. You see, I will always remember uh uh a president I found exceptional, who was President Giscard Destin, who unfortunately only stayed 7 years, huh. Moreover, it was President Mitterrand who succeeded him and who then spent the rest of his life trying to come back. So it's me, I... well, first of all, I would n't have the qualities to do it. I probably wouldn't have the patience, and even though I have ideas about what could be done in the economy and so on, I don't want to get involved officially, and I much prefer what I do, which is a lot of fun. I have fun every day when I arrive at the office. Yes, I do . Yes, absolutely. Yes, yes, I have fun every day. Yes. And so, uh, I don't think I would ever have the same uh pleasure in politics today. In politics, when I see situations where compromises have to be made in all directions, like right now for example, it's extremely difficult for those in charge. It's very, very difficult. I ca n't see myself in that role. No. Do you sometimes think that when someone says something bad, you don't want to be friends with them? Do you pay attention to what's being said in the media, or do you not care, or do you just not look ? What is your opinion on this? Because people often talk about you. Yes, but it leaves me completely cold and in most cases I don't even look at it and people say, "But have you seen this article?" No, I didn't see it. I won't read it, I don't care at all. It's true. Absolutely. Yes, yes, but that's the attitude to have. Yes. When you finally arrive in France and you succeed a little bit immediately you get criticized, huh. Well that's it, that's all, often from people who don't understand what we do or who want to criticize for various reasons of their own. What is it for? There's no point in polluting your mind with that in my opinion, right? No, no, but there could be something that, on a human level, hurt you. It can happen even if we don't care or see something, we feel hurt because we work for something and then something comes out that is completely false. Well, there are a lot of false things that have been said. Yes. But mistakes from A to Z. Mistakes from A. Ah yes, but from A to Z. I'll give you an example. You might ask me a question. That has always surprised me. Uh, about the Princess building that we built in the United States with Michael Burk. So, when you went to the United States, Michael Burk, I'm just going to take the liberty of saying because it's crazy, you're still working with him today. Yes. And you asked him to accompany you and help you because he spoke English at the time. He was your intern. No, he was at EC and I took him on as an intern because obviously he had dual American and French nationality. So he spoke quite a bit of English. Yes. And what's more, he's an absolutely brilliant person. He's forgiven, he's still in the group today, right? He is still with me today. Yes. Yes. He is the president of VMH USA and he came back with you as an intern. That's funny. Yes. Yes, yes. But loyalty does matter in business, you know . And so this real estate deal, the first real estate deal I did in '81 when I went to the United States with him, we built this Princess building. Corre building. Yeah. magnificent building that is still there. In fact, I spoke to him on the phone a week ago, and he said, "Hey, I drove past ." Well, uh, I've never understood why people say it was a flop. We have never had such a successful and profitable real estate transaction . Ah! Oh wow! Even you are surprised. That surprises me because when I typed it, I found it interesting to learn about chess. Not to say you have failed, but to understand. It's certainly on the lists of failures, but it's said everywhere. He's your number 1 when we ask, yes, well, it's probably the best real estate deal I've ever done, and unless you call Michael Burk, ask him, you'll see, he was the one in charge. We've never done anything so profitable. And why did they turn that into a failure? Well, that's something to know. I don't know. I can tell you that. I have absolutely no idea . Incredible. Yes, every time we see Bernard Arnaud with a private jet, for example. Yes. Uh, that's something you've been criticized for a lot too. Is it? Yes, yes yes. That's for other reasons. Well, that private jet is for other reasons, you know. They even wanted to follow my trail, you know . So now I've fixed the problem, which was a few years ago. I sold I no longer have a private chat. So, it's sold. You had to have gel because you go to factories if you want to take when we travel around the world, huh, when we go to three or four cities in China and then we go to Macao, we go to Seoul and we go to another city in Korea, we go to Japan, to cities in Japan. Then we go to Los Angeles, all that and we do it in a week. Impossible to do on a commercial airliner. Completely impossible. So, you've sold, and now we can't follow you anymore. You can't follow me anymore. When I have to do that, I rent a plane. Here I am, lots of jet companies made by a whole series of, well, nobody can spot me. Besides, it's interesting because otherwise, not knowing where I am isn't very useful. Even for safety. Yes, as for security, I don't know. But anyway, we thought, he's here, but what could he be looking at? I don't know what. Do you ever take the train ? Of course. I actually inaugurated the high-speed train back then. The TGV to Lille. Yes. Yes. Yes, indeed. Someone told me they saw you. Yes. So, for Brussels, exactly. Yes. In second class. Yes. Yes. Yes. Because there was more space. But that doesn't bother me. It's in second class, right? And I was with one of my sons, I can't remember which one, at a friend's funeral in Brussels, and he said to me, "Did you see the head of Mediapart on the train ? He said, 'I'm going to tell him you're on the train because he keeps writing terrible articles about you for taking a private jet from Paris to Brussels or something.' Well, there wasn't an article. Second class, right? There's a disconnect between what we see in the media and your life. Do you ever think, 'I do n't understand why?' But again, I'm not interested in the media that talks about me. That really doesn't interest me, because most of it is so false it's funny. But there are mistakes. There are other things like that. You might be going to tell me about Boussac too. Oh yes, I was just about to get to that. You're coming to that too. We're in sync. Look at my profile. I could... I could do a TV show. I can give you the profiles if you want, I'll answer. Uh, the takeover of the Boussac group, so that was in 1984, right? December 1984, you were 35 at the time. Yes. To tour in France, so after the United States, yes. You bought the Boussac group, which was bankrupt at that time. It was a group that wasn't doing very well. Uh, there were several brands. There was Dior, there was a real gem inside. Uh, Le Bon Marché, Conforama, well, there were a lot of brands. There you go. You ultimately kept only Dior and Le Bon Marché. How did you go about buying Boussac? Which had a lot of items Also on that. So, I'm going to explain. I'm going to explain because there's a lot of misinformation there too. The mistake, what's generally written about it, is that Mr. Arnaud started it, of course, but it was the State that helped him, that gave him money, public money for private use. There are many articles about that. Wait, wait. So, I'm going to give you some figures because figures are still interesting. When I took over this company, it had been bankrupt since 1981 when President Mitterrand came to power. And here we are in 1984. He had put, they had put, the government of the time. Initially, Mr. Moroi had put at the head of this business, uh, managers who knew nothing about business. Hm. And so they were sinking, they were losing a fortune every month. Uh, I think that at the time it was Not far from 100 million francs every month in France. And so at one point, when the European Union came around, they said, "We have to get out of this. It's not up to a state to manage the colossal losses this affair entails." So they looked for buyers. They put out a call for tenders, and there were three bidders. We were one of the three. I'll skip the details of the call for tenders and so on. We were all roughly in the same range. We offered to put up 400 million francs . I didn't have that kind of money. So I put up 50 million with the family group, and I had investors who came on board for 400 million, and we asked the government for a loan. That's roughly 400 million, which is roughly 70 million euros. And we asked the government, and the two other competitors as well... They were asking for the same thing: a loan to get 400 million from us and 400 million from the state. And this loan is a loan, so it's repayable, with a variable interest rate depending on what we call a return to better fortune, a return to profit, and so on. That's how it was time to reverse the trend. We wanted to turn things around. If things turned around, we would repay more than the interest rate. That's what we did. We turned things around. I'll explain the social problems and so forth later. And, uh , not only did we turn things around, but we repaid more than the money we were lent. And now people are saying, "Yes, but still, what a scandal, Mr. Arnaud!" "Boussac's money, how did the State make his fortune ?" Well, I'd just like to give you a figure. We received a loan of 70 million. Since then, the group I built from that has paid the State 70 million euros, the equivalent, you know, to pay the State in the form of taxes and social security contributions 40 billion. OK. So this is, and we can congratulate Prime Minister Fabius at the time, the best investment ever made by the French State at any point. We're talking about a 70 million loan repaid, and we're getting 40 billion from the company, which has resulted in this period up to now. There you go. So when I hear these criticisms, frankly insane, well, it's incomprehensible. I don't care at all . You have the story about the number of employees you were supposed to keep too... At the time, I believe there was an agreement. That's right. That's right. We had 12,000 people. We had committed to keeping 10,000, and we didn't keep that commitment. So why didn't we keep that commitment? Because what we found was worse in the factories. The Chinese competition was very strong, and we were forced to reduce our workforce even more drastically. And there too, at the time, we had roughly 12,000 people. When we arrived at the group we built from there, today, directly, we have 220,000 people worldwide. Okay. And in France, between direct and indirect employees, 40,000 direct, 60,000, uh, 160,000 indirect who are with suppliers, 200,000 people. So, okay, we didn't keep our commitment of 2,000 people, but now we have 200,000 people in France. There you go. So, perhaps we can stop one day, and that That goes back 50 years, right? Maybe we should stop bringing this up one day because there's a climate in France where, for various reasons, we can't stand something actually succeeding, especially if it's privately owned. It's like when we make donations, right? We made a donation. Have you made donations several times ? Well, several times. There are two I remember. Yes. The one for Notre Dame de Paris. Yes. When it unfortunately burned down. Yes. You donated 200 million euros. Yes. I think so because you're at the very top of the donor list. There's a plaque there now. We did a report not long ago on Notre Dame, which, by the way, as a side note, featured you in 10th place. Yes. Yes. Yes. You weren't at the front even though you were the one who gave so much. I don't need to for the inauguration. I want I prefer to remain discreet. Yes. And you gave another time to the Restos du Cœur (a French food bank charity). There you go. OK. So, to the Restos du Cœur, which was practically bankrupt, well, we gave, uh, I think 100 million if I remember correctly. Uh And immediately, well, it helped them a lot. It prevented them from going bankrupt. But how, 100 million? Why is he only giving 10 million? It's petty, it's appalling. You should n't do that. And that's the party, I think, of Mr. Mélenchon. But then, he kept quiet. Why did he keep quiet? Because he realized that on his social media, his voters had gone there, you know. There's a lot of talent. Mr. Mélenchon, I'm not going to criticize Mr. Mélenchon, but well, let me explain, he saw that his voters were protesting, saying, "What, are you crazy? He's giving 100 million to the..." You're criticizing Restos du Cœur , it's unbelievable. And that was all there was to it. I still have the photocopies. What were you criticizing them for anyway? Oh, well, for not giving enough, sir, but he could have given two or three times as much. Okay. Right? As for Notre Dame, well, the criticism is, but, and, and we still raised 200 million. It's very important and very, very useful for this project. Oh no, but it's the State that should be doing that. It's not a private company that should be handling that. Well, we must be dreaming. We must be dreaming. In fact, you give money to Restos du Cœur one day and it backfires on you with bad press and, you shouldn't exaggerate. It's criticism from a politician who wanted to do some PR. No. No, you Never answer. No. Well, under the young people, say no. There's another one who is doing it for whom I 'm finally, now it's slowed down, but I was a marketing tool. It's Mr. Ruffin. François Ruffin. Yeah. Who is a left-wing French politician. So, I was his he uses me as a marketing tool, marketing director. Whenever he wants to do a little advertising on TV, he talks about me. He made a film about you. Yes. Which was called "Merci Patron!" Absolutely. Yes. So, I watched that. You watched it? That one? I watched it. Yes, because I'd heard so much about it , I finally watched it, and I mean, it was quite funny. It's true. Yes. Full of mistakes. Full of mistakes, but quite funny. And I think, moreover, that it brought him a lot of money. But good for him, right? There are some false things in it. It could be a mistake. I can't tell you exactly what, but I wrote them down . It's because they're accusing you of closing a workshop, I think. And yes, lots of things like that, but it's always about the Booussac affair. This is something that goes back 50 years. But if you want, uh, I think I'm more used for his marketing, which is actually declining a bit, right, since Mr. Mélenchon may have sidelined him a little. Why? Since he doesn't have Mr. Mélenchon's talent for giving speeches, I think he's kind of falling into oblivion. But anyway, I don't know, I don't want to dwell on that. There was the VMH takeover after another important step in your career, June 3, 1987. There was Alain Chevalier on the Moetensy side and Henri Racamier on the Louis side. Viton. They were going to merge their groups at the time. They were going to create a luxury group, LVMH. They were going to tear each other apart at the time. I understand the history well. Rakamier, Mr. Rakamier, was going to bring in an outside investor, so that's you, and you were going to buy back shares and actually take over the group, I think it was two years later, is that about right ? Hm hm. When you arrived at LVMH, initially as a small shareholder, did you know you wanted to take control of the group, or did it happen naturally because of opportunities that arose? How did it happen? Well, if you want, in that case, when I did that operation, everyone was saying it was an extraordinary marriage of egos, and it's practically a business that runs very well with very calm management, and so on. Okay, fine. As it happens, even before that point, there was the 2000 crisis, and I had bought some shares. So, I was interested in seeing how things were developing, and especially since they owned Parfums d'Or and I owned Couture. So, I was also interested in seeing if there was a possible merger with Couture because I think that for a fashion house, it's essential to be able to manage its perfumes. And they were separate, which caused problems. And when I arrived, , I realized that, in fact, and this was perhaps a year after the merger, the two leaders were fighting, completely antagonistic, and that if we left it as it was, the business was going to have major problems. So, they said it wasn't possible, and one of them, Camier, wanted to cancel the merger and sell the wine and spirits division to our English partners. distribution. That's not possible to do, and I opposed it, and that's where the argument started, and finally I took control. And besides the shareholders from Mr. 's family left at that point, they sold their shares, nothing special, but they would have done well to stay, they would have made a lot of money. But we still have a number of members of the Viton family at Viton who stayed. Yeah, whose name is Viton. Yes. Yes. And I think someone told you at the time when you bought Louis Vitton, you said, "Anyway, it's already top-notch, you can't do better." Yes. Yes. Yes. Someone told me that, one of my investor friends. Yes. And you made 1000 today? No, but he simply did n't know the business, if you will. So he was saying, "I see a lot of Vuon bags." He said, yes, a lot of Sacon, because he was in Paris, in circles where Sacon was sold quite a bit, except he hadn't seen different things. For example, he didn't realize that at the time we weren't yet established in China. You see, at the time we had extremely limited distribution in the United States, and the whole global market was opening up. You do n't see all the possibilities, do you ? So, you have a passion, it's the piano and music. You're a big piano enthusiast. How did you get into it ? I think it's really something important to you. Well, that's a family thing. My mother plays a little piano, my father played a lot of violin. I still remember hearing my father on Sunday mornings practicing the Sibelius concerto, and that made me want to start playing the piano, and that's it. So I played the piano. I even won a competition when I was before my baccalaureate. I think I was 13 or 14 years old, and it always fascinated me. Yes. And now I listen to concerts. Have you performed in concerts yourself? Yes, yes, yes, yes. But well, I haven't done any solo concerts, you know. No, I think you have. I've done concerts, three-piano concerts. Three pianos, six pianos, three pianos. Absolutely, with your son and your wife. With my son and my wife. We did one, well, just before the problems with Russia, in Moscow, conducted by Vladimir Spivakov, a Mozart concert. And yes, when I have a little time, I try to play the panel. If you like, I can also tell you an anecdote that happened to me because some time ago, you know, we have a very beautiful concert hall in the Louis Vuitton Foundation. Well, one day I was told I absolutely had to come because Maestro Maurizio Polini was there, and we were trying to get him to come and play the concerts, and he wanted to see a bit of this hall. So I go there with my son Frédéric who plays very, very well, much better than me, with my wife who is a professional. So there we are in the concert hall and uh we say to Maurizio, "Okay, can you play something to uh test the sound?" Very well. Uh he says "No, no, I don't want to. No. So, I turned to my wife and said, "Okay, I'll play something." " No, no, I can't play in front of Mauriziopoli. Impossible. It's difficult to play in front of him too." "Very well." I said to Frédéric, " Go ahead then." "No," and at that moment I told Paulini, "Well, you two, a little bit, go ahead." And there I was on stage. At the time, I was playing clumsily, but still, Chopin's Sonata No. 2, and there I was, starting Chopin's sonata in front of Mauriziopoli. Incredible. Well, I only played the first part, which is easier, but, uh, it was still quite stressful. Were your fingers shaking at that moment? No, because I was trying to do well, you know . If I had had to play the second movement, I might have had more difficulty because that's really difficult. And I saw that you also bought Radio Classique as As a classical music enthusiast, it's not at all the same as your other companies. Did you buy it for pleasure? Why did you buy Radio Classique? I bought it because it was offered to me. It was Pierre Fort, then with Sagem, who owned it. He wanted to sell it. He had learned that I was a musician, that I was interested, that I listened to Radio Classique, and so it happened . He was also a graduate of Polytechnique, by the way. Yes. So you're talking about the Louis Vuitton Foundation, which you're going to inaugurate in 2014. The Louis Vuitton Foundation is a contemporary art museum located in the heart of the Bois de Boulogne near Paris. It has welcomed over 1,000 visitors by 2025. That's enormous. It's more than the Montinchel Museum can imagine. In 2010, it became the fourth most visited museum in Paris. behind the Louvre and Pompidou in terms of visitors and renown. Why did you create this foundation ? Where did the idea come from? Was it your idea? How did it come about ? I've had this idea for a long time. I've had this idea since the early 90s. I had this idea because I thought, with a colleague who is still with me, who now runs this foundation very, very well, named Jean-Paul Claverie, I thought that the group derives its success from designers who are n't really artists, it's fashion design, it's more about applying it to them. It's a world of creation, and it would be good if we found a way to give back to this world of creation what we take for the profit margins of our businesses. And initially, we had already considered, back in '92 or '93, I can't remember exactly, creating a foundation in the Bois de Boulogne, in another location. And the The town hall at the time was run by Jacques Chirac, I don't know why, but it didn't work out. We did n't get authorization. So, we still had this idea, we examined many other sites, and finally, when we saw, in the Bois de Boulogne, at the time it was a bowling alley. It was a bowling alley. There was a bowling alley there, on the site of the foundation. Yes. Yes. Which was very ugly. And so we thought we might try to offer them something fantastic. I spoke to Fran Guerry, the exceptional architect I had seen in Bilbao when we visited his museum there. And at that moment, he found the place extraordinary. He even cried while visiting the site, and it reminded him of his time in Paris, of Proud, and so on, and so we said, we can't miss this opportunity. And I convinced the mayor of Paris, Mr. Deloé, to accept the project, and we launched it. It took a long time, actually, because, as always in France, there was a lot of opposition—a lot of opposition, you know. But a museum in the Bois de Boulogne? It's impossible! And finally, after about ten years, we opened this foundation in 2014. It's right next to the Jardin d'Acclimatation. For those who know Verneuil, it's a children's attraction that we manage with the group. It was a concession that belonged to the Boussac group. And why did it go to Boussac? I can tell you about that; it's quite amusing. Mr. Marcel Boussac had his apartment on the street right across from the Jardin d'Acclimatation. And he was woken up at night by lions, because at the time there were lions there. She says that's not possible, I want to sleep with those lions. Okay, I'll buy back the amusement park and remove the lions, so we bought it back to remove the lions. Absolutely. And at that time, when we took over Bousac, which is the origin of LVM, we had the amusement park to manage, and we still manage it to everyone's satisfaction , I think, because it works very well. Did you take your children there when they were little? Of course, of course. Yes. And we redid the rides, the roller coaster, and so on. It's great. It's, it's, it's great for families. It's very good. Yes. So, I heard that you're involved in other things. Can you tell us a little about what you invest in personally? Yes, well, personally, uh, I've been investing in technology for some time now, and in particular I started, uh, at the time of the internet launch in the late 90s, and I made a number of investments. You remember that period when the internet players had built up a kind of bubble, and some businesses exploded while others survived. So, there was an investment I hadn't planned on, you know. I was in an American fund, I had invested in an American fund on the West Coast, and my partner, who manages all that for me, said, "Well, we're going to take this as a profit because, like other American funds right now, they must have lost everything." And one day, we get a message saying, "Well, we're sending you the shares we have, but we don't have any more money, so we're sending them back." The fund is dissolved and we receive a good amount of Google shares, which I believe were valued at €2 or €3 at the time. Here's the action. Yes, the action. Yes, yes, yes. And something like that. At the time, we didn't really know what it was, did we? Google. Yeah, we didn't know about it at first. No, no, no . So after that it went up quite a bit. How high did the shares go, by the way? I don't know anymore. I don't know about that. In the meantime, they were sold. I don't know how many there are today, but we've certainly made a good profile. There is sometimes an element of luck in business, although in this case it was really luck because we invested with very reputable people. They probably did too much and their overall fund had to be liquidated. So we received our code as part of what remained after liquidation and uh it ended uh it ended like that. It was a good deal. Yes, it was a good deal in which we had absolutely nothing to do. There's another one in which there's another one uh in which uh there we're involved in something and we took a percentage, always with the same team that's always with me. We took a percentage at the time of Netflix's creation and we had almost 20%. It's from Netflix. Yes, absolutely. Well, that's a very great success. So, you may have asked, perhaps you could ask me if there are things that didn't work or things that you regret. Yes, I sold too soon. We made a very good investment, but since then I think it has increased tenfold. Tenfold again, no less. There you go, see. So sometimes you should n't sell too early and not too late. Don't sell too early. No no no , it was I don't remember who said what the secret of your fortune is. He used to say, "I always sold too early." There's a story with Steve Jobs if you'd like. To conclude the show, I have a couple of questions. Uh, Steve Jobs, I think you knew him. Yes, you gave him advice that still inspires today, that has inspired the shops. Yes, he had asked us if we could give him some advice when he launched his in- store sales. And at the time, nobody in the technology industry was selling their products, and there were no telephones back then, you know, they were selling their products in shops, and they were told, "If you want to make beautiful shops, come and see what Vuitton is doing." He had sent someone to look into it. Uh, he had told me about it and uh, uh, he was advised to set up shop in places where there is, in particular, a very beautiful store uh, which I saw again last week in Tokyo on Ginza, magnificent, where there is always a great crowd at Apple, and so he was obviously very intelligent and very friendly. And the last time I saw him was in Brussels, right? We talked and he said to me, "Well, my iPod," and I thought, I think he'd just launched the phone, the very beginning. You know, my phone is great, but yours is even better because I'm sure that your father will still be around in a century, and my phone will be completely obsolete. He was funny. You know, you've met a lot of people in your career. Uh, who impressed you the most ? Because we were talking about Donald Trump, presidents, great entrepreneurs, you know almost all of them. Who impressed you the most in your life? Well, that's a difficult question. Yes, because there are many. There are several, but perhaps the one who impressed me the most intellectually, in terms of personality and worldly knowledge, with whom I became friends and who, every time he came to Paris, would come to dinner, was Henrier, who was an extraordinary person. When he talked to you about the geopolitical situation, it was fascinating. He was Someone extraordinary, and yet, and yet he wasn't always listened to. Once, when I had dinner with him, he told me, "It's very annoying, uh, I still send memos, a memo from Henrique Singer on geopolitics. When we receive it, we read it. He had sent a memo to Obama, he told me, 'I regularly send memos.' He does n't even read them." Well, in 2006, you experienced a tragedy. You lost your sister, Dominique. Uh, can I talk to you about it? Can I ask you a question? Uh, you were very close to her. What was your relationship with Dominique like? Well, we were very close. We spent our childhood together. Then, she worked as an auctioneer in northern France while I was starting the takeover of the Boussac group, then Dior, then LVMH, and she came to Paris afterward. She had a great sense of aesthetics. She especially loved jewelry, and she was with me. When I took over a very well-known brand, at least in France and Europe, called Fred, she was there, and I asked her if she'd be interested in running it. She did . So she ran this brand, and it was very successful, until one day, unfortunately, she was very young, a little younger than me, a year younger, she succumbed to cancer, and for me, that was a catastrophe. It was unexpected, especially since that type of cancer—I won't go into details, but today it wouldn't be fatal, you see. There you go. And my sister, she was truly an extraordinary person, kind, very arts and culture oriented, and I miss her very much. I think I still think about her almost every day . Yes. Yes. Did she teach you anything? Do you still remember her and sometimes use her teachings? Well, when you're faced with death, it makes you think, it makes you Reflecting on the fragility of human beings. There you go. Has it changed your relationship with death ? It changed my relationship with death while, uh, reinforcing my idea that we have to live, you know, and still be careful in everything we undertake, you know, because she could have been treated and she could have detected her illness much earlier, you know. But well, she had other things to do, she said. I'm not interested, I'm doing very well. There you go. So you get checked out, you're more careful now. Me, I'm even more careful because I play a lot of tennis with a certain intensity, and so every six months, I get a test to check if the machine is still working. If the heart is working well, yes. I don't want to end up like that, but I don't smoke, so the risks are limited, but I check. Yeah. Is tennis a real passion for you ? Well, it's a sport that I love it. Do you still play today? Oh yes, yes, yes, I play 4 hours a week. So, it seems you sometimes play with Mr. Federer? Is that true ? Yes, yes, well, I'm friends with him, you know . I think he's a sensational man who, apart from his talent— perhaps the best player of all time—is extraordinarily, uh, nice, cultured, friendly, and from time to time we go on vacation together, and he does me the honor of letting me hit a few balls with him, and when we play matches, it's usually doubles. So, indeed, when I have the chance to play with him, uh, we very rarely lose because it's just the two of us. There you go. And you have a good level, you play, well, is that something? You can't compare my level to Federer's, that's not possible. It's like comparing my piano playing to Rovit's. It's not possible. Yes, That's impossible. You're a great art lover and collector too. You have a very, very beautiful art collection. Uh, you started a very long time ago, I think. Uh, I don't remember who I told, but someone said you had a very beautiful collection, not because you were wealthy, but because you have good taste, because you knew before others which artist was going to... Yes. In any case, I started to become interested in paintings by going to museums with my parents. There's a very beautiful museum in Lille, with very beautiful Bruegels. There's a very beautiful museum in Brussels. It's very close too. There are also some very beautiful Flemish paintings. So I started visiting museums, visiting exhibitions with my parents, and I was immediately interested in it. And then gradually, with the foundation, I was led to buy a number of paintings for the foundation. I also buy some for myself. There you go. But that's A very, very exciting field, and one in which you meet artists. For example, when I lived in New York, back in the early 80s, I did n't have much money. So I would go to the galleries, and we saw great artists like Warhol and so on. Well, obviously, I couldn't buy their work. And there was one I spotted in the galleries called Basia, who, incredibly, wasn't really an artist whose reputation had risen significantly at the time, and so I bought a few of his pieces. Yes. Which I still have. But you've never resold a painting ? No, no, no, no, but I don't buy paintings as an investment, even if it happens, but because the value increases, the value increases, but when you own a painting, you don't want to part with it, unless you need it, which is n't my case. Is that Is there a piece you dreamed of owning, but you weren't able to buy it? Well, for the foundation, you know, I've tried several times to acquire certain pieces that I have n't been able to see. For example, I tried, but it's not possible, to bring Garnica to Paris. Hmm. Well, that did n't work. However, I did manage, for the foundation's first exhibition , in 2014, to bring Munch's The Scream, which is also a historic painting. It's a fantastic painting. Yes. Yes, I'll show you the image so you can see it. Yes, there you go, you can show the image. It's historic. And then, I think we managed something with Suzanne Paget and Jean-Paul Claverri, who works with me at the foundation. Suzanne is in charge of all the artistic aspects, and Jean-Paul directs the foundation. We managed to bring extraordinary collections from Russia twice, and that had never happened before. The collection and the Morov collection, with works—I don't know if you perhaps didn't visit at the time—but extraordinary works by the greatest French painters of the early to late 19th and early 20th centuries, which had been sold to two Russian collectors, Stockin and Morosoph, and which the French hadn't bought. There were Gogins, a great many Gogins, Van Gog, Bonard, well, I won't list them all, but you see, it was there. And now, for the next collection that will succeed Calder, which is currently with the foundation, we've managed to bring over a painting that, for me, is a mythical painting by Van Gog, his self-portrait in the hotel with the broken gold and the bandage. It's equivalent, for me, to the Joc. It's something of the most conventional paintings, and it's been almost a century since it came to France. And we're going to The exhibition at the Louis Vuitton Foundation, so you can tell your viewers that starting in October, that you're the one behind it, making the calls, asking questions, it's really something you manage as well. Well, it so happens that this painting belongs to a friend, so there you go, you're involved in the choices, and that's something you enjoy. I participate. Yes. Yes. Yes. In choosing the exhibitions, this one is going to be quite extraordinary. You're going to support sports. I wanted to talk briefly. Formula 1, you 're one of the biggest partners. Why did you choose to be the first partner? Yes, because Formula 1 is a sport that today really evokes performance worldwide, with a very large number of Grand Prix each year, and which is very close to the spectators, young people in particular, to the world of spectators who are interested in high-end products. Quality, because I attended, for example, the Monaco Grand Prix a few weeks ago, and when you see the way these cars are prepared, you know, I went into the preparation area for the Red Bull cars, you know, with Verstappen, the former world champion, who was behind me. He gave me a lap, you know, before you took a lap, yes, yes, before the circuit, the day before the circuit, you know, at 250 km/h in the streets of Monaco, passing close to walls. I can tell you, we remember that. Anyway, it was around that time that I thought about the risk, the risk... Have you ever been able to drive a Formula 1 car, even just for 100 meters? No, no, no, no, no, it's too dangerous, I didn't ask . Oh, it's a no. I wanted to finish with Paris. I can talk to you about football if you don't mind, briefly. Yes. And first of all, is football a passion of yours, or do you see Where am I going with this ? Yes. Well, you see, because we bought Paris Football Club. Okay, so, I have to say, I was pushed by my children, who are all passionate about football, and they told me, "Well, it's not a very high investment, but it has a lot of potential because it's the second club in Paris." And I told them, "Okay, but if you do this, I support it, but first you have to get promoted to the first division, Ligue 1. They were in Ligue 2 when you bought them the first year, and they got promoted to Ligue 1. So now I'm saying, you have to get selected for European matches." So I'm waiting, I'm waiting to see if they 'll manage it without it costing too much money because, well , you have to find the right players. But here too we have Red Bull as a partner, who have several football teams and are particularly good. Will you ever be able to beat PSG, to be above them in the standings, I mean, because beating them in matches has happened. Yes, well, my sons tell me "We're the only club this year to have beaten PSG twice." Well, unfortunately it was n't in the European Cup final. I don't know about that, I, well, I'll let them do that. I'll take care of the rest. In conclusion, you have had great success in your illustrious career. What is the best gift you have ever given your children? I don't know if it's a gift, but in any case it's something I gave them and allowed them to cultivate; it's the taste for work, because they all have a taste for work, I can see it. And you know LVMH, I often say that to new candidates or new recruits. LVMH is not a normal company. It's not an anonymous company with an anonymous board of directors where you just change people like that and you barely know the people who are stupid administrators. LVMH is a family, it's a family business and within LVMH, it's a family and so I ask that everyone at LVMH consider themselves members of the family and that's why the children are very happy there. We'll see how they develop, we'll see how they can progress based on their quality and results. They are all still young so everything is fine and all the members of the group are in a family. You have Delphine, who is the CEO of Christian Dur couture today. Antoine, who is CEO of Christian Dur, is the family holding company and also handles communication for the entire LVMH group's image. Uh Alexandre, uh, who is the CEO, so delegate of Frédéric Mensen, who is the CEO of Europiana, a magnificent brand, a very nice business, and Jean, we were talking about him earlier, who takes care of the Huitons Watches, who run the 8 Years Watches. Are you proud of him or Yes, I am very happy to see that he is progressing and that he is really giving his all to what he is doing. So, after that, uh, progress at LVMH is through a meritocracy system. So there you have it, for now uh everything is fine, huh. But again, the atmosphere is a bit like in my grandfather's time, we are in a family business and I always tell them, uh, LVMH, you have to consider it as a start-up, you see, even today. Yes. Yes. And it must be managed as such . We must flee the bureaucracy. Is the trend in governments in Brussels or many organizations to constantly increase bureaucracy and create bureaucracy, paperwork, reports, regulations, things that slow things down? We need to speed up, and to speed up, we ca n't speed up if we're covered in paperwork that's generally useless. To still operate like a start-up today is interesting. We try to operate like that. Yes. Yes. And to go very fast. To move very quickly while trying to cultivate quality, history, know-how, everything that explains the extraordinary success of these brands throughout the world and that makes LVMH the ambassador of France worldwide. One last personal question, I have two left. Are you a grandfather today? Yes. Are you able to enjoy time with your grandchildren despite being at the head of the LVMH group? Do you have some time? Yes, regularly. Yes. Yes, absolutely . They come to the house regularly and I see them. Yes, yes, absolutely. It's very pleasant regularly and they enjoy seeing their daddy. They call me dad. Is it easier to be a dad or a grandad in terms of education? Well, it seems that when you have children, you have to take close care of them, huh. Um, the grandchildren, um, we see them for pleasure. Are your grandchildren the only ones who can manipulate you with just a smile? Yes, yes, yes. They like Coca-Cola and ice cream. One last question about your career: what are you most proud of today? Well, obviously, having created, uh, I think it's one of the first times, uh, a French world leader which is also the leading French company by market capitalization and which still has a lot of potential and is only at the beginning, huh. And so uh I still have many years to enjoy uh managing LVMH and uh developing all the employees and members of this group in the future. So. What was the best decision of your life to end things? Well, it was probably starting from the Roubésienne company, the Boutsac and Dior adventure, right, and leading to, right, who could have predicted that from a company in difficulty that we turned around, we would build a world leader in France. But, well, you always have to manage businesses closely. I'm going to ask you a couple of questions about entrepreneurship if you don't mind . What mistake do 90% of young entrepreneurs make? If some of you have a desire to be an entrepreneur. What advice could be given to avoid some common mistakes? Well, when you start a business, first you have to be passionate and you have to want to work in the field you want to launch, right? The first thing is, you have to be really passionate. Then, I think you have to be patient. Don't think that it's going to work immediately. As I was saying, uh, this week when I went to Vivateek, you know we are founders of Viviatech, and we were also asking questions about start-ups. What matters most, beyond the initial idea, of course, you really need to have a good idea, but it's the execution. So when you launch a start-up or when you want to start a business, even if it's in a field that's not in technology, you have to have a sense of execution and you also have to be ready, I believe, to encounter difficulties. We shouldn't be afraid of difficulties or even crises because they are very common. Don't get discouraged. The first difficulty, the first time the banker calls you saying "Whoa there, be careful, the loan is too large, you have to resist, you must never give up." No no , if the idea is good, if you take for example the field of the internet, I think that at the beginning uh Facebook, there were several dozen that did the same thing, huh, pretty much the same thing, huh, with listings of students in this or that university, but there was only one that worked. Yes, and that's the idea, the idea was there but the execution was lacking, but only one person managed to make it work. That's Marc Luckberg, right? Should you follow your passion or seize opportunities that you may have in business? The idea is that opportunities are linked to passion, right? That's the best. Or it's mine. and one of my main friends and advisors at the beginning was Antoine Bernhim. He always told me the secret is to be in the right place at the right time. Look at that. So, a bit of luck is still possible. And that plays a part, that plays a part, that's luck in entrepreneurship. Yeah, when we want to. Yes. To invest, you need a bit of luck. Yes. What is it you cannot forgive in business? What I can't forgive in business is lying , you know. It's a lie because it happens, it's happened to me, you know, to be lied to. Yes. Yes. Let's not go into details, that's not the point. Did your father give you any advice as well? in the business that you hold dear. My father, yes yes, he gave me advice when I arrived because on one hand he was very proud that I arrived, a polytechnician arriving at Roubet, I think there weren't any others at the time. Okay, granted, he was a Centralien, which was good even in the eyes of the employees. I thought, "Okay, but he told me first, uh, when you arrive you have to try to understand how it works and above all, don't change things too quickly. Trust the people who are there and try to provide them with effective help." And he was telling me now, between us, there are going to be two types of relationships. The relationship in which I am your father and the relationship in which I am your boss. So. And you were able to do that? To separate the two? Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes. But my father, well, we always got along very well and he handed over the reins of the company to me quite quickly, very quickly, because he thought maybe he can do this without me. So there you have it, but he still followed along a lot, you know, and he was always a driving force. When I took over Boussac first and then Dior LVMH and all that, I asked for his agreement of course because I have a lot of respect for him and he always agreed. No, he's a true entrepreneur. You asked him for his opinion on your future choices afterwards. Yes. I asked him anyway when we took over Boussac, it was still a huge risk. A small company in Roubein, I think you know the details, but I asked for his agreement and after thinking it over carefully , he gave it and he told you go ahead, let's go. A father who wouldn't have given it away, right? Because there was a very big risk. Do you sometimes feel lonely when you're a top boss at the very top of the pyramid? Sometimes we talk about the loneliness of the boss. Does this ever happen to you? Well, we're on our own, which means that ultimately it's you who decides. So, mainly about the problems, and here they are . So. And so, uh, we must avoid, uh, believing that we are right, especially, right? And I think that you have to be capable, I tell them, I tell all my colleagues, you have to constantly question yourself, constantly. And you have to have an attitude that I quite readily adopt, which is to be constantly dissatisfied and to say to yourself, "Well, all this is good, but it could be better." You see, it's a state of mind and you have to listen to the contradiction because you have leaders even in companies who think they are right and that anyway yes, we are told to do this but if we do n't understand, we have to listen to the contradiction. Ah yes, the risk is that no one dares to tell you when they disagree or it's important that people can. Yes, but I like it when people contradict me, you see. It's necessary, even if sometimes I think they're wrong, but at least you have to, so solitude yes, but you also have to set aside moments for reflection, you shouldn't be constantly going from one appointment to another, from one trip to another. That's what I try to do with a subject that is sometimes limited to many things rushing by, but you need moments for reflection. And do you have time to reflect? Do you have moments in your schedule just to reflect? I try, I try, I try to set aside periods where there are very few appointments and where I can see people from a different world than the world of business to get different ideas about the economy, about other areas, about history, you see. And in your eyes, what is the essential quality, if there was one, to last in entrepreneurship? If only one quality were needed, what would it be? I believe that one must be persistent. How would you like to be remembered ? Is there something you leave behind when you're at the academy, something to pass on as well ? First, I think it should happen as late as possible. need to remember me and well then but what do you what I good I what I have done more if we can say remarkable without wanting to show false modesty to create and build what is today the first French company listed on the Paris stock exchange and which is the first company in our sector of high quality products. Yes, I no longer call it the luxury industry because I'm a little wary . And uh, which uh is a French company, a world leader. There aren't many of them, are there? That's your greatest source of pride. Yes. That's a source of pride for France too, is n't it? Exactly. Yes. Yes. In fact, when I travel, I feel a bit like an ambassador for France. Obviously, we have stores in most countries around the world. So when we promote French luxury, we try to promote Oui. the French heritage of quality craft production. Absolutely. What can we wish you to do to improve my topspin backhand? Thank you very much. Thank you for giving your time. The interview went well. Alright . Alright. Yes. THANKS. Thank you so much for coming. Thank you to all of you for watching this video with Bernard Arnaud. Thank you for being here in ever-increasing numbers, making Légendes the number one podcast in France. 150,000 to 200,000 of you subscribe every month, in addition to joining us on the YouTube channel. So thank you very much for being here in ever-increasing numbers. Thank you to the whole team for preparing the show with me. Thanks again, Bernardo. Thank you so much. I send you lots of love and we'll see each other very soon for another video about legs. Hi everyone. Amen.