Ro, super looking forward to speaking with you today. Thanks for being on the show. >> Thank you so much. I've been watching your shows and I really love everything about them. I really appreciate you having me in here. >> Cheers. So, you have a top 1% community. You're super active on the platform. I noticed that you have oftentimes more than a thousand activities a day. How do you manage to stay so active on school? >> Very good question. I'm keeping it together via a lot of practices that I do also that are not just typing. I do meditation, yoga, hike with my dogs daily. And of course, the most important part is getting into my joy zo joy zone often, which is what I teach in my community as well. And it is to just play childlike and have fun and be in your joy zone. be in your creative mode because that state is so powerful that makes you perform better at any other area in your life, relationship, business, you name it. That's makes it so much better. >> So when you're engaging then it's I I know that a lot of people might show up to engage as kind of a job like uh with Hermosi advising like do 100 minutes uh you know the rule of 100 like you just have to kind of get the engagement there. Um, do you kind of follow that where you you show up at a certain time and you treat it like a job or how is it different? >> Absolutely not. Um, I love Hermuzzi and Leila and much respect to them. I haven't watched much of their content, but I have some, you know, and I love that uh he's on a platform and he helps us grow, you know. He has taught a lot of things to a lot of people. people respect him. So, mad respect to this guy. Um, I just don't do it that way. For me is showing up authentically. It's not on the clock ever. Whenever I'm needed, I I am there. I'm on school 24/7 and and you know mostly from my phone because I don't really like to sit on my butt too much and um I use school from my phone mainly and uh yes it is a bit restricting especially for someone that is used to using it on a laptop and how can you do all that on a phone? Maybe it's harder, but at the same time, I I can do things, you know, pick up my school with me everywhere I go. >> And when you're engaging, are you are most of those activities happening in schoolers? Are you in a lot of different communities? Like, how are you networking? >> Yeah. So, I am uh working with a group of friends in a new app development that is specifically designed for school and I'm labeled there as a power user. And it's as it's and it's it's create it's collecting data. So it's not like it's my opinion or their opinion. It's the app is using AI and algorithms to collect all this data. So I just like went to out of curiosity and it says power user in many communities uh super active hyperactive. So um I I wouldn't say that I'm that active in that many communities. Uh but I am in some um yes very much so. Um I'm there for my people and I was there. Yeah. To help with whatever I can 100%. >> Do you have like with your with your own community? You have the star which isn't an easy thing to do. How did you manage to get the star? >> Yeah. Uh it just popped. I didn't like try to get it per se. It just popped and then I realized what it means and I was like, "Oh, wow." Okay. And it is the authentic showing up for your people and um the fact that contribute and grow and uh yeah everything else comes after that uh really and uh I see a lot of communities right now you know that they get in score and then um try to immediately make money and with community that's a little bit not the case. That was probably with courses and memberships which I've done a ton in my past and do not resonate because of lack of community that that was what was missing in all of those failed ventures. I wouldn't quote failed really more like lessons learned you know because there's no like failure there's lessons. >> Yeah. >> Makes makes sense. You mentioned before we started recording that you had been kind of following Sam Ovenans, the founder of school for a while and in a few of his different programs. I think probably he was doing more course based stuff back then as well. So how why did like have why did you decide to join school with Sam here? Like what tell me a little bit about that kind of history of working through his different programs. >> Yeah. Uh I love Sam Alvin. He's an amazing human being and so purpose driven. Uh even if it doesn't make sense, if there is the higher purpose, he will go for it and he will go through anything to accomplish his goals. It's it's amazing. He's amazing as a mentor and all his programs are amazing. Even the ones that are very outdated already like the consulting accelerator. Um yeah, very amazing program. Actually the the program is for consultants which I didn't even wanted to ever be one but I I bought it because I was like please take my money after watching his webinar because of like how he is as a human being you know and the best thing in the program I found is the second module which is about mindset. It just blew my mind and it changed my life forever. Over eight years, nine years ago, long time. As I said, it's outdated. It doesn't exist anymore. But it really changed my life. Uh that one module and all his videos were so long in in that program. Oh my goodness. Uh so long, but so good, packed with value. Uh so I didn't come to school because he was Sam. So um that that's a good reason. Um and he has invited me a long time ago and I was like eh I don't know one more platform I didn't until in in April this year 2025 whoever is watching the video 10 years from now 2025 yeah I was in two accidents back to back real bad and that caused me to cancel a summer European tour I'm a touring musician um and also Burning Man And I was like, I had to go five days a a week um in therapy, so I had to stay put. And for me, it's hard to stay put. So, what do I do? Let me uh do a community on school. And for me, I knew it was going to be a learning curve there first. And then second, um my lowest hanging fruit, piano, because I grew up as a classical pianist. I always played, I I taught for decades. So I was like, well, let me learn the platform and while I'm learning it, I will help a ton of people in the process. So I created the the piano community which is now has evolved uh into not just piano. We have all kinds of musicians and music lovers and very solid mission I'm on and it's a very happy place. Yeah, >> that's interesting to me. So, the the piano community, was that what if I'm understanding this correctly, it was partly created in order to kind of help understand the platform and just kind of, you know, figure it out because it's your first community. Is that right? >> Yeah. I had programs in the past that are membership based and um you know, like courses and memberships and community is a small part of those. you have to have like a Facebook community or Instagram group chat or WhatsApp and it's like kind of Frankenstein al together and um it's mostly like business platform with maybe community features like Kajjabi has a little community but it sucks just the whole that's another like a can of worms uh and I'm not going to go into that but school is more a community platform with business feature So the core of it is is humanto human interaction authentic showing up for each other and that is exactly what um you know my a little bit issue with the platform is we're missing that uh in a way to where we could expand we could do more and um it's it's amazing as it is and we can do better and my next goal is to get the rocket. So that way I could actually voice my opinion and been be listened to um by higher up people that wouldn't necessarily pay attention in what I'm saying right now in the moment and wouldn't agree, wouldn't care maybe, you know, but uh with the time this is going to change and it would be for the better. >> Why do you think the rocket is important to have your your voice heard in school? >> Yeah, very good question. Because you see, school is amazing and still has a lot of the bro marketing old approach of other platforms that people that came from other platforms and doing the same things. Maybe there in school maybe a little bit different but still kind of the same. And the rocket represents um certain amount of income that you're bringing from the platform. Um that's what I have found that people listen to those people more people listen to those people than not uh you know per se. >> This is the next mission. >> Do you I want to be careful about where to go from here because I feel like this is a really important subject. >> It's deep. >> I'm curious I guess about specific examples with the bro marketing stuff. like maybe can you go into more detail about like the kinds of things that you think are being carried over? >> Yeah. Yeah. That that can go many different ways. Um I I'll first answer your question. The bra marketing well treat your community as an email list. So so so don't engage necessarily and as hey how are you? What's your favorite song? That's a community question. Everybody has a favorite song. Everybody likes to say how they are. That's why not done um in this communities that I'm referring to. Anyways, it's not like I'm the owner or the voice of that community and I'm going to do anything about it. you know like even inside joke something f funny silly uh would be so much more bonding in between the members and they will trust you more versus just tell them here's how I made $100,000 in 5 hours that's exaggeration but you know what I mean and if you want to get in you have 72 hours to join with the scarcity excuse me come on we're already over that but still works for some people and they're still um you know making money doing that and that's the priority so so be it in my case what I was referring to like you know get the rockets or be listen to some people is because I believe that community is a shared effort and each member contributes more to the community than it takes if that makes any sense like sharing wholeheartedly with the community, your craft, what you created for this community, you know, and uh with that said, there's that part and I had Sunday sessions in scholars that I was playing for scholars every single Sunday and it was just showing up and playing bringing joy and bringing break from the screens just for less than five you know each Sunday I call them Sunday sessions and it was my contribution to his quarters and uh with this uh Hermasi tsunami there was a lot of um of people coming in so a lot of uh you know um moderation to the community. So a lot of posts of course got moderated and deleted and people sometimes get salty, right? And so some people have reported my um uh post with the Sunday sessions as not being community building related. So I got contacted by the admins. Okay, it's not it's been reported for not being community build related. And I'm like how is it not when it brings people together? Look at all the comments of gratefulness and I'm not gaining anything out of that. I am just bringing value contribution to this community. Pure joy >> and whoever uh was in the comments was very grateful. Nobody was like what the heck is this doing here in this community, you know. But anyway, I didn't really argue because you can't admins are doing their job. But see that's one example how like let's say I get the Rockets and win the school games and like I am in front of the right people to talk about this stuff. These people are going to talk to the admins and change the rules of like yes it is a community building bringing people uh together you know through music through art whatever it is a community building. It's not it's not not and everybody, you know, has a favorite song or a song that they don't like. You know, everybody has an opinion about it. It is a community building. It is a combo starter. It is a brainstorming session and a a bringing people together experience. Anyway, that's one one story. But another one just happened this morning and it just breaks my heart how uh it really it is so not community um response. Um we have a member of one of our communities that reached one of the highest levels and was very engaged and suddenly disappeared on November 24th. Well, okay. Maybe taking a break from school or taking a break from online or whatever, right? November 24th. A few days later, I'm meditating and I got this vision that like he's doing something to himself. And then I'm like, "Oh, wait. He has a community for suicide prevention." I mean, like, how random is that? Who makes a suicide prevention community a 501c3? So, it's like a legit nonprofit. uh organization that you go through a lot of hoops and loops here in the states to create a nonprofit like that. It's a lot of legal work. So anyway, and I'm sitting thinking that and I saw this in meditation and then like I kind of started to worry a little bit. So I started to investigating. I went and looked everywhere where he has seen last what he has talked posted or whatever. Then I went looked for his social. So um in his um emails and phone numbers and addresses, everything I could find. Um and then a bunch of us were working on this together. It wasn't just me. And um somebody called um um don't want to mention names, but I mean that was a secret that everybody knows in the community. Anyway, uh we called and they said, "You need to find somebody local that to walk in into. We can't do anything from off the phone uh for the police to act." Uh we're like, "Okay." Um anyway, I posted this in um one of our communities, the biggest one, and um because that's where he was at and everybody knows him there. As I said, you know, he's very active and been reached Never Wait is like second to the last level. very very high level and everybody knows him. Um so I posted there and we started creating this train of comments and brainstorms of like who is in that area. It's uh what was it something very like weird name in Michigan. So we were trying to locate somebody there that can walk into the police off of anyway I posted in schoolers with uh because he's also a schooler. He has a community. He's schooler. So he's one of us. He is a member of scholars of members of one of us. And um you know I try to be like not emotional in the post but you know straight to the point and um they deleted my comment and I received a message that uh I I have screenshots. It was devastating how I know they're doing their job. But like I said, you know, like, okay, I I I really hope in my last message that it this turns out to be some fluke. And I hope you don't get to get proven that just because you're doing your job, you're not being a good human. You know what I mean? And there's that. And I I think that was a community post that somebody can pop in from nowhere, Michigan, and be like, "Hey, I'm here. I will walk in in five minutes and I'll take care of it." It's it's that simple. But why did you have to take down the post, you know? So, so little little stuff like that that could have a huge impact on somebody's it could save somebody's life potentially. How is that not community uh related? Um it's a community member. We all care about him. Obviously, it's a huge train of just like that post like went like it's a huge post already. And anyway, so I ended up calling some number that's reached some police um and um talked to somebody and I was like, I hope they do something about it. And I just before the call with you, received a voicemail from a deputy, forgot his name, doesn't matter. And uh saying that they have checked on him. He is fine, but we're not going to be seeing him soon. So I did a screen recording and I posted it in the post where the post that stayed, not in scores to that didn't stay. Uh but in the community that um he was a member of our community, I posted it there um and pinned it. So everybody sees it that um the police said they checked on and it's fine. But you know, it's a good thing. I'm I'm very grateful for it that this turns out. But it's an example. You know what I mean? Kind of like the music thing. It's an example that this is community related, okay? And if we have more of that, then we're going to have less of the bro marketing BS that is too much and it's like so repelling for so many people. And that's why a lot of people don't want to get into school that I've talked to. They're like, uh, that's like another platform like that. Like what? And if they do enter school and see that, uh, yeah, I was right type of thing. and then my reputation is recommended and goes down the drain. And I love school. I'm literally here 247. >> Yeah, this is such an interesting uh conversation for me. I feel like well, first of all, I think that we probably have a bit of a similar background in terms of music festivals and things. You mentioned Burning Man. And for me, what attracted me to school, a big part of it is because I was seeing the kind of things on school that I've seen in these kinds of areas. um real communities that last many uh many decades even people who are you see each other develop um real relationships build and I was seeing that happening in school which is why I was so interested in it um and I think you're right that real community would involve the kind of posts that you're talking about like if schoolers is meant to be an example of what a community is then it would need to have, okay, this is the piano player who does songs on Sunday. Like, that's part of what a community is. You have different people with different skills who have different things to offer. Um, and it's not just about I made this much money in this amount of time doing this tactic. Um, although I do understand that school is also like schoolers is there to help people learn how to build community. So, that has to be a priority for them as well. So I can see how it would be a hard thing to balance. Um >> I agree. I totally agree with you. Uh and uh with what I'm um trying to say here that I should have start with this that like the two ways uh you know like okay playing on Sunday or whatever and then uh the other one for the missing person post. So these are not necessarily um so they they are mutual effort but they are showing how community works actually it's showing that's what community is you know >> that's true >> uh but see if my boss was like I did 10 grand on school in a week boom my post is going to go viral nobody's going to take it down trust me and especially if I have some screenshots regardless if they're doctor or not and that's another yeah too much said too much there but you know what I mean show you show people we learn by showing like uh >> yeah that's true >> how to tie your shoe you can read five books or somebody can show you in 3 seconds and you will learn it you know the same thing like we learn by showing from each other from babies we learn >> as yeah >> showing >> that's true I'm curious like what they could practically do cuz I I completely agree with you and for me that's what makes it very school very interesting is that I see that in many communities especially the smaller communities where I feel I can get more of that but for something with schoolers with 200,000 members I wonder like does somebody have to be known to the admins or something in order to be able to make a post like that because if you have everybody posting >> different things it could lose the focus Um any like tactical thoughts about how they can do that or do you like where where does the line for freedom where is that drawn? >> Yeah. Um perhaps different categories. Um it's just right now there is one is discussion and um I I know they try to keep it clean and simple as as school is as a platform is pretty straightforward pretty clean pretty easy user friendly easy to use and uh yeah that's very cohesive everywhere just uh when my posts were taken down saying that it's not community building related how is it not when I'm showing you how you build the community and and you know I I was always polite with the admins when when they um when they respond you know like I was never rude. It it's just gets to the point where I feel like talking to the wall talking to them because they're just like stating the same thing but with different words and yeah it's it's their job uh to do it. I'm not pointing fingers or blaming anyone. It's just that that's why I I I got to get to that level to where I'm bypassing them to have a real conversation with somebody can actually do something about it. >> They're just doing their job. So like they going to keep doing the same thing. >> Yeah. >> So yeah, one of them I I kind of stopped talking, you know, it's it's just pointless. Okay, I get the point and there's nothing you can do about it. >> I wonder if putting like you mentioned the categories. I wonder if maybe making the fun category like having a category that you can only see when you click on it or something so that you could still have all of those fun posts but it wouldn't be part of the main feed and that way they'd still get the kind of focused community building in the main feed but then have a different feed where you could do you know actual this sharing our gifts and things like that. Do you think something like that would work or do you feel like it could it should all be kind of mixed together? Yeah, I mean it was uh it was mixed together before as well and it was working fine even before we got so giant after her the hormon tsunami in August >> and we have a really good search option for any questions that anybody might have can just type in and then there's a thread of beautiful post popping populating the the search. Uh, so it was fine. You know, just because we're bigger, it doesn't mean it won't work. So, >> got it. >> I know this is pretty like all of it is pretty contradictory. It's just it felt right to share. >> I Ro, I really appreciate this conversation. I think it's uh I think it's really important. So, thanks for being on this on the podcast today. >> Thank you for inviting me. appreciates.